4 months ago
Mike Prada
59 comments
1 recs |
Email
PrintComments
Great stuff
and yes he so so badly needs good screen setters, we havent had a real PnR all season. Mcgee and Wall have no two man game whatsoever, which is what then turns every possession into the iso wing jumper
I just don't see why you need to trade Mcgee
everyone knows the going rate for centers shot blocking rebounding ones imparticularly . Jordan of the Clippers got paid for being less productive than mcgee and has similar immature ways about him only thing is the Clippers team around him is better so the image he carries isn’t negative or viewed as a drawback.
We create a huge hole in the roster moving mcgee then are forced to pay the freight on another center of equal caliber.
Mcgee is a good kid and works hard,I don’t see him as a lost cause I think in the right environment he’d be fine.
I just think we can’t be the masters of the moment and not see whats ahead with regards to the talented players we do have.
Pay the man and move forward or watch as he becomes the hub of another franchise and we start the clock on finding another guy.
Mcgee is a good kid and works hard,I don’t see him as a lost cause I think in the right environment he’d be fine.
I could see this, but that environment isn’t here.
by Mike Prada on Jan 24, 2012 4:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You are advocating the blowing up of the plan, and I don't think that's wise
If Ted didn’t have the stomach (not trying to be funny) for a terrible record, he wouldn’t have chosen the course he did. You don’t draft young guys and then start raffling them off because the environment isn’t conducive to their development. You change the environment.
If I’m Ted, I tell Ernie he has until May to develop the kind of learning environment that has Wizards players acting like they are at the Harvard of basketball camps. If that doesn’t happen, Ernie’s gone.
A learning environment, not a winning environment
And Ernie’s had years, not four months.
No disagreement there
So maybe Ted needs to call Pritchard this afternoon.
I'm not a fan of Pritchard
And he’s a bad fit for a high profile owner like Ted. Cho sounds great, but I don’t think he’s an assistant.
And I guess the reason my reaction to your take is so negative
is that it is so Abe Pollin. Pollin never developed the right culture to produce excellence. So he couldn’t bring in young guys and develop them. He had to bring in guys that were developed elsewhere. Unless you are willing to have a huge payroll, that is a strategy for mediocrity.
If you decide you don’t have, and aren’t ever going to have, a good learning environment, and thus need to trade McGee, then you (1) are committing yourself to only acquiring players who are already developed, whether they are NBA veterans or 3 or 4 year college players; and (2) you should trade Wall now, too.
I thought the hope with Ted is that he would change the enviroment, and hopeful raise this franchise beyond mediocrity. I’m not ready to give up on that dream yet.
Ted probably realizes he should have fired everyone and clean slated the whole thing.
Ernie will not be re-upped unless the team shows an almost shocking level of improvement imo
Let's hope he realizes that now
If he doesn’t, that’s concerning.
I think you're stretching my point
I hear ya, but here’s my response.
1. Never said they’re never going to have a “good learning environment.” It can be fixed. Just think it’s going to take time because not enough steps were taken to fix it right away.
2. Never said that’s why you trade McGee. You explore trading him because he has an inflated sense of self-worth, will probably ask for too much money this summer (i.e. get something for him instead of losing him for nothing) and repairing any environmental problems will take longer than the amount of time needed to decide what to pay him. I also think rewarding players like McGee with new deals can be counter-intuitive to fixing that environment.
3. The “Seattle plan” isn’t saying what I think you’re suggesting. It’s just saying, “OK, we have two young cornerstones and we don’t have unlimited development capital. Let’s pour our energy into making these two young cornerstornes the players they can be.” To me, some of that is finding guys who already know how to play. Not saying your Rashard Lewis’ of the world – just guys in their prime instead of rookies. Doesn’t have to be all those types of players, but there are just too many marginal young talents on the roster now for any organization to develop
by Mike Prada on Jan 24, 2012 5:21 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
My “flip” answer (tribute to you, Philip) is that any owner who can’t develop a culture that can handle a player with “an inflated sense of self-worth” and who “will probably ask for too much money,” should sell his NBA franchise pronto. Open a flower shop instead.
My somewhat flip answer is that the Wizards don’t have two young cornerstones. They have Wall, you have them trading McGee, and they have a draft pick this Spring that may or may not turn out to be a cornerstone. I don’t disagree with the idea of building around young cornerstone. I also don’t disagree with the idea of deciding that McGee will not be one of the cornerstones, will not be resigned this summer, and deciding to move him now to get some value from him.
But I strongly disagree with the idea of moving McGee because your haven’t created the right environment to develop him. That is such a loser’s mentality.
by disgrunted on Jan 24, 2012 5:35 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
slight correction
I meant IF they decide McGee will not be one of the cornerstones, to move him now. I don’t think I would agree with that, but if that’s their conclusion, it would be smart to move him.
I meant IF they decide McGee will not be one of the cornerstones, to move him now. I don’t think I would agree with that, but if that’s their conclusion, it would be smart to move him.
That’s my conclusion, pretty simple. Not sure where you’re getting the idea that you move him because you created the wrong environment to develop him. That’s moving backwards.
Fair to disagree of course, but that’s really all it is.
by Mike Prada on Jan 24, 2012 5:43 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
'cause these assumptions are taken as givens
You don’t draft young guys and then start raffling them off because the environment isn’t conducive to their development. You change the environment.
Pollin never developed the right culture to produce excellence.
and you reinforced these assumptions, mike:
I could see this, but that environment isn’t here
for the record, i think there is also an assumption that with the right coaching you can MAKE guys into good players.
as should already be clear, i subscribe to NONE of this. simply competing against other nba players is by far the biggest ingredient in developing players. players either become good or they don’t and it’s mostly up to the player and their natural abilities. it was pretty obvious rasheed was going to be very, very good after year 1 and we gave him up. now that was dumb.
by DarrellWalkerFan on Jan 25, 2012 1:26 AM EST up reply actions
Ultimately Blatche, Young ánd McGee symbolize everything that is wrong with this club
I have been a NY supporter alongside Rook, I have been a McGee supporter alongside half of the BF community (rough estimation) and I have jumped off the Blatche Bandwagon just before he returned, pied on it and then set it on fire.
However, today I have arrived at the conclusion that we should break with McGee. A culture cleansing means getting rid of all things and people, tangible and intangible should be parted with. McGee is a great talent and has lot’s of untapped potential, but sadly, he IS one of the faces of our old culture of goofyness, un-professionalism and zero accountability.
Who won? Who lost? Who cares?! The NBA is Back! - David Aldridge
What seems to be the officer, problem? - Randy Marsh
by Dutch Hoopfan on Jan 24, 2012 5:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Agree totally
especially with trading McGee now, while his stock is high. The mix on the team right now is just way too raw. There has to be someone on the team who is A. competent, and B. has experience playing in and winning NBA games. I feel like people downgrade that too much, but learning how to win is as much a learned skill as anything else. The Thunder could do it because they had two phenomenal young talents who could score and were committed to getting better. We have no one on the team who is capable of doing that. Lewis could be that player, but he obviously doesn’t have much left after all those years of soft living with Dwight in Orlando. There is no one else on the roster that can fit that bill, and we need one desperately.
by seewhite on Jan 24, 2012 11:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree with you, Mike...
The environment may begin to improve but it is a long and winding road ahead.
That bring us to your thoughts on McGee, with which I also agree. He is not untouchablee. As I see it, we have only three (or four depending on how you look at #3 below) choices with McGee…
1- Lose him as a free agent this summer, which is totally unacceptable.
2- Keep him by matching the offer he gets this summer, which is likely to be in the four year $40+ million range and which JaVale might actually be worth, but then again….
3a- Trade him now for a first round draft choice and a solid mid-range player or 3b- even up for a higher gain, higher risk guy like Cousins.
On that whole, 3a is probably the safest choice, while 3b could be a home run if Wall and Cousins mesh as they did in Lexington and we draft a third A-list player in June.
Re: Blacthe. As I have said before, I think that Blatche is tradeable if we can get back someone who with an equally problematic contract who may be a better fit for this team even though his present team has no role for him… My frontrunner for this deal is Josh Childress in Phoenix, which is still looking for a PF. Childress is smart (Stanford), a classic three, good defender, low usage, and his European experience could benefit our two Euro projects, Vesely and Seraphin.
My keeper out of the bunch remains Nick Young, pending what transpires over the next four months. I cannot shake my feeling that there is something inescapably special about this kid. He can score, he can defend and he has the capacity to learn. $9 million a year? Uh-uh but by this summer, if he has a productive remainder of the season (17-19 ppg, 2 apg, 3 rpg) he is worth 4 yrs at $30 million.
I don’t doubt for one minute that Ernie is under the gun to make some smart deals happen if he is to avoid Flip’s fate. We shall see.
I don't think Mike's "Seattle model" would be a a huge departure for the Wizards
The Wizards have spent the past 2+ years accumulating young players. Many of them can remain part of the team’s long-term plan. I’d say Wall, Singleton, Booker, Vesley and the 2012 pick is a nice young core to build on. Rather than focusing on youth, I’d say it’s about time the Wizards prioritize adding the right talent.
I don’t believe dumping McGee is a requirement for turning things around as some have suggested (Jason Reid). But I would be extremely hesitant to sign him to the type of contract he’s likely to get this summer. Thus Mike’s idea of trading him if a decent offer comes along seems reasonable to me.
by Johnnie Futbol on Jan 24, 2012 5:21 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah, that's kind of where I'm going
Only thing I would amend is that if anyone other than Wall and the 2012 pick can be used to find a guy who can play now and isn’t getting older (like a 26-27 YO guy), you explore it. But no, wouldn’t just dump them either.
how do you trade Javale as an RFA?
Doesnt he have to agree to the trade or make it an S&T?
That would seem to severely limit Ernie’s ability to get anything for him
not to mention word gets out around the league "hey everybody, ernie's shitting his pants again!"
dealing from a position of weakness
that will be an issue
The other will be whoever trades for McGee will need to be willing to sign him to a contract worth $10 million per year or more. That too will limit what the Wizards will be able to get for him. But the option at least needs to be explored, especially if the Wizards have any doubt that McGee will be worth the big contract they would have to sign him to.
by Johnnie Futbol on Jan 24, 2012 5:31 PM EST up reply actions
but isnt that the trade EG turned down (rumor) this past draft?
I dont see how he could sell that to Ted, considering he went out and drafted 2 SFs and would now be trading Mcgee for the one he passed on a few months earlier
it just seems to paint EG as a bumbler imo
because Jan and CSing are invalidated by a trade like that, in the same year Ernie drafted them
well...
The wizards have talked about “accumulating assets” which is about the only justification I can imagine for drafting a handful of players that are fairly redundant anyways. They can trade away one or more of these “assets” I hope.
by Johnnie Futbol on Jan 24, 2012 5:53 PM EST up reply actions
the funny thing about that is Mcgee is the one player
Ernie has drafted and developed that could be traded for a higher pick than he was originally taken.
We laugh at Kahn and his 1 million PG's in the 2009 draft
But Ernie drafted Booker, Seraphin, Vesely, Singleton and traded for Lewis……
At least Kahn got 1 legit core piece out of it in Rubio. I don’t see one among our group of redundant forwards. Ironically, Kahn got Rubio from Ernie for an expired ham sandwich and bag of chips
Who won? Who lost? Who cares?! The NBA is Back! - David Aldridge
What seems to be the officer, problem? - Randy Marsh
by Dutch Hoopfan on Jan 24, 2012 6:06 PM EST up reply actions
who knows if that trade option was real then
but even if it was, it’s time to reevaluate.
by Johnnie Futbol on Jan 24, 2012 5:49 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah
There’s too much overlap anyways between Vesley, Booker and Singleton, so I’d say the Wizards should trade one.
by Johnnie Futbol on Jan 24, 2012 5:29 PM EST up reply actions
This season we "held our powder"
Is it possible that we should have been more active with trades or signings? Would we be this bad if Ernie actually tried to do something with this team over the offseason other than pick up more raw projects? How about drafting a guy at six with experience and high baskeball IQ, and signing a FA replacement for Nick Young. How about trading Blatche last year? How about amnestying Blatche before THIS season? Ugh, it’s like running around in circles. They have really made some bad decisions over the past year that set us back.
I sort of agree
I could see keeping Javale if we get rid of Dray and Nick. Honestly, though, it’s hard to see how this team would not be better right now with a journeyman at center. At the start of the season, Turiaf was coming in and looking like an all-star. Ronnie is not an all-star, he just looks like one by coming off our bench and doing what he’s paid to do.
by Elvin_is_my_Elvis on Jan 24, 2012 4:41 PM EST up reply actions
Everything you said is right
But there’s no reason to trade away our only promising player outside of Wall. How about finding a coach that can teach McGee properly and get through to him, or keep him around as a backup? Same with Young. If you can get him for cheap, keep him. If not, bye bye. You can put those two punks in check simply by getting the right veterans, coaches and front office people on this team.
The Seattle plan might make more sense now that MLEs are reasonable.
I haven’t read much on how the new CBA will change team building strategies, and nothing from the Wizards front office on the subject.
That was an excellent article but...
….I will never agree with you that THIS is the time to trade Mcgee.
1) I feel he joins that expendable list. You know his potential is too high and what exactly do you hope to receive back for him? This feels like Webber for Ritchmond or Wallace for Rod Strickland all over again
2) I still feel you need a coach that is a leader that the guys will respect (Mark Jackson type guy). Also we need an assistant coach who’s sole responsibility is to develop our big men. (Mcgee and possibly an Anthony Davis or Andre Drummond).
My point is that its irresposible to trade Mcgee when he has too much potential and has NEVER played under a coach that has worked to develop his talent (E. Jordan, F. Saunders)
Trading Mcgee would just prove that the wizards are nothing but the farm system for the rest of the NBA.
Enduring the pain of wizards basketball....one game at a time
On the Seattle model...
Theoretically, it’s what we should be striving for. Wasn’t it this past draft where Leonsis said we have established our core, and have completed the “rebuild” aspect of this whole process of turning us into contenders? Now it’s a matter of bringing in players entering or in their primes.
I’m a bit hesitant in trading McGee, because the crop of centers in this league is rather weak, and I only see two in this upcoming draft class that can surpass him (Anthony Davis and Drummond). I’d wait till the draft, and execute a sign and trade with McGee once/if we are awarded the #1 pick or #2 pick in the lottery.
http://twitter.com/Above_Legit
Ah alright, that makes me even more hesitant in letting McGee go.
The thing is, no matter who we draft, we’ll be faced with just another project that will take a year or two to develop. McGee is a player with flaws, but has also made strides in his game. This isn’t the 90’s where you’re faced with great centers who are capable of playing on both ends of the court at a high level. The role of that position has changed drastically, and McGee fits that mold to a tee. Replacing him will be harder than we anticipate, I wouldn’t mind giving him Deandre Jordan money.
http://twitter.com/Above_Legit
the asthma is the kicker for me
i find all the stuff about dunks and me-first or whatever to hold little to no weight….but if he cant breath, there’s just no way around it. There are many nights you can see from the get-go Mcgee is in trouble with his asthma, they need a full understanding of that when making a decision
Davis is a PF, def not a center
Theres also Meyers Leonard, who’s a fringe lottery pick, should be a solid all-around center, and Tyler Zeller, but I don’t know that much about him.
The Seattle Model.....
…..assumes John Wall even stays here. He has 2 more years then he becomes a restricted free agent. My guess is year 4 he will demand to be traded from this mess.
Enduring the pain of wizards basketball....one game at a time
The current model assumes Wall even stays here
The Seattle model adds more urgency to building a playoff team now.
True but....
……who on this roster other then mcgee is going to get you the veteran talent you need to apply this model?
Enduring the pain of wizards basketball....one game at a time
OK, heres my plan
I say we keep wall and mcgee and lose nick young………
1) Amnesty blatche if he can’t be traded
2) Buy out Rashard Lewis if he cant be traded
3) Draft Drummond or A. Davis (Drummond gives us flexibility of moving to center if javale doesnt work here)
4) Dont sign Jeff Green! The 2 best players in the draft are power fowards and we just drafted vesely. Signing Jeff makes no sense.
5) Use our cap space to acquire wing shooters. Gallinari, OJ Mayo, Jodie Meeks, Mike Beasley, and Ryan Anderson are all restricted free agents that may be worth a look.
Enduring the pain of wizards basketball....one game at a time
Possible, but if you have to determine a course of action from here on out, you start with Wall
Who won? Who lost? Who cares?! The NBA is Back! - David Aldridge
What seems to be the officer, problem? - Randy Marsh
by Dutch Hoopfan on Jan 24, 2012 6:09 PM EST up reply actions
You bet...
But the window on Wall only stays open for so long. There is so much work to be done here… but, hey, other franchises have turned it around… perhaps this one can. Certainly today’s action is no more than a first small step.
100% agree that Wall is our only untouchable.
I know McGee has improved beyond what most people in his draft status do, but if we get a good deal for him, we gotta get rid of him for possibly another lotto pick.
by thewiz06 on Jan 24, 2012 8:04 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
NBA Playoffs Content Module
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- David West hilariously denies each and every one of his young fans a high-five (VIDEO)
- Behind the Box Score, where the Miami Heat are moving on to the conference finals
- Kevin Durant is tired of hearing about the Spurs
- The 10-man rotation, starring your Indiana Pacers
- Blake Griffin highlights, ‘NBA Jam’-style (VIDEO)
