Rook's Take On Washington Wizards Draft Picks: Analysis And NBA Draft Grades
So the NBA Draft is over - and our Washington Wizards picked a European forward, a potential defensive stalwart and a combo-guard. Obviously I would have preferred a trade to move up to select either Derrick Williams or Enes Kanter, but as Mike Prada pointed out in his post, it takes two to make a trade.
Apparently teams wanted to fleece the Wizards by asking for the No. 6, No. 18 and the No. 1 pick next year - Crazy talk. (Hey David Kahn, I hope you have fun trying to move Michael Beasley... LOL... Good luck with that!).
So it is what it is. I really think that Kanter was the perfect fit for the Wizards next to both JaVale and Andray Blatche. But the Wizards were forced to hang on to the 6th pick (and the 18th) and stick with plan A. Unfortunate... but I guess it was better than mortgaging next year's Lottery pick. So here's my take on the Wizards 2011 draft. I've graded each selection and my overall grade is at the end.
With the 6th pick in the 2011 NBA Draft, the Washington Wizards select Jan Vesely
I saw more than a few comments on draft night about the Wizards drafting "another soft Euro." Let's put a damper on this right away - Jan Vesely is NOT another "soft" Euro with a finesse game and a penchant for avoiding contact. He's a very athletic Forward that will run the floor, slash hard to the basket, and play with energy and intensity for 48 minutes. And despite his slight frame (230 pounds) and his baby faced appearance, Vesely is a pretty tough dude. He's not afraid to throw his body around in the paint and take charges on defense. I hesitate in calling him "physical" ONLY because he takes contact rather than dishing it out - but he certainly doesn't shy away from contact; and he doesn't back down from anyone. He has a bit of a nasty streak about him, and loves to dunk on people.
Before I dig into his deficiencies, let's discuss his positive attributes first. Vesely is fast and athletic - a perfect fit next to John Wall. He gets most of his points in transition, on hard cuts to the basket and on offensive rebound put backs. In other words, on a team full of high usage players (Wall, Young, Blatche, Crawford, etc.) Vesely doesn't need the ball or have plays run for him to score. Although he needs to improve his footwork, he's got a pretty decent post up game, especially when he has a smaller player on him.
Having said all that, Vesely does have his deficiencies. It's well documented that he's not a good shooter (yet) and that he has trouble at the Free Throw line (54% in the Adriatic League last year). The other knock is that he's not a very good rebounder. Lets look at these one at a time.
His jump shot is not broken - he has good form with a quick, high release. He usually shoots square to the basket and he gets good rotation on the basketball. So why is he a poor jump shooter? I can only guess that it's practice and experience. He was mainly used as a cutter and a lob target in Partizan's offense - in addition to being a huge part of their fast break. He was rarely called upon to shoot the ball. Plays were NEVER run to get him an open shot. As everyone knows, shooting is as much mental as it is mechanics and muscle memory. Vesely needs to practice shooting.. and then practice some more... Until he becomes confident in his shot. My biggest concern, and the one thing that may shoot holes in my theory is that Vesely is a terrible Free Throw shooter. Usually guys that shoot poorly from the field, but shoot well from the Free Throw line can improve their percentage from the field... With Vesely shooting so poorly from the charity stripe, does it mean he won't ever be a good shooter? Certainly if he cannot improve his shooting percentages, his value will diminish quite a bit. We'll have to wait and see.
As for rebounding, the stat-heads would have you believe that Vesely is useless as a defensive rebounder (2.6 per 40 minutes pace adjusted in EuroLeague play); but that's why we watch the games to get some context. Much of Vesely's lack of rebounding production lies not in his abilities, but in how he was used playing for Partizan. The Partizan Coach Vlade Jovanovic mostly had Vesely playing at the point of the defense, around the foul line. Not the ideal position to grab a lot of rebounds. In addition, Vesely, because of his speed and athleticism was frequently leaking out on the break. After watching many Partizan games, it became apparent that this was by design. Jovanovic's style is to use his Center (Nathan Jawai), Power Forward (James Gist) and Point Guard as his main defensive rebounders - with Vesely and the Shooting Guard as outlets for the break. So while I don't believe Vesely will turn into the next DeJuan Blair, He won't be as woeful on the defensive boards as his EuroLeague stats might otherwise indicate.
On the offensive side, and playing mostly on the perimeter, Vesely was often the player designated as the first one back on defense. So while his offensive rebounding numbers are actually not bad (2.6 per 40 minutes pace adjusted in EuroLeague play) - they could be a lot better if he were allowed to crash the offensive boards more often..... a strategy that I believe the Wizards WILL employ.
On the defensive end, he'll struggle his Rookie year. He has the physical tools to be a good defender. His lateral quickness is adequate to stay in front of most wings - and his size and length are superb for the Small Forward position. He's extremely active on defense and moves his feet well; but as a perimeter defender, he tends to stand too upright and that is where most of his problem lies. He'll get caught reaching (fouling) a lot after getting beat. In the post, he just doesn't have the bulk to guard the bigger players. As for team defense, the outlook looks a bit better. Vesely's speed, length and athleticism allows him to close out on shooters, and rotate to open opponents. He's a very good weak side shot blocker, and his size and length should be an asset in Flip's zone schemes. Still, overall I'd have to say that Vesely will be a liability on defense for a couple years. The good news is that Vesely is an intense competitor, and an extremely hard worker - and those types rarely make for bad defenders. I believe he will improve as a perimeter defender over time.
All in all, the Wizards got an intense player with a high Basketball IQ; A player that has several years playing professionally on one of the best teams in Europe; a player that plays with energy for 48 minutes... Vesely has a few things to work on. He needs to become a better shooter. He's also got to work on his ball handling. Shooting can be fixed. Ball handling can be improved... But effort, intensity, willingness to work - those are things that cannot be coached. So if you are like me and you are hoping the Wizards are in the process of changing their team culture from one of entitlement to a culture of hard work, effort, and a will to win, then the Wizards got good value at pick 6.
I begrudgingly grade it a wavering B- .
With the 18th pick in the 2011 NBA Draft, the Washington Wizards select Chris Singleton
Singleton is a 6'9", 230 pound Forward from Florida State. He's a good athlete with excellent length (7'1" wingspan) and strength. And as Mike Prada pointed out, he's Fast Fast Fast.
Did you think John Wall and Trevor Booker are fast? Absolutely. But what if I told you that Singleton posted a better 3/4 sprint time than both of them at this year's NBA Draft Combine? It's true. Whereas Wall ran the sprint in 3.14 seconds and Booker did it in 3.1 seconds, Singleton did it in 3.09 seconds.
As everyone knows, I've been high on Chris Singleton all year. He is the single best defensive player in this draft - and in my opinion, the best defender to come out of the last five drafts. He has the ability, the physical tools, the work ethic and the mentality to become an elite NBA defender. In College he guarded everyone from Point Guards to Power Forwards. He was particularly adept at playing the pick-and-roll because he could switch off onto ANY guard.
As Mike pointed out in his excellent article in May for SB Nation:
The experience of working with Leonard Hamilton, one of the best defensive teachers in college basketball and a guy who has a scheme that closely resembles an NBA one, means you can be sure his defense will translate.
He does have his offensive deficiencies. He is a poor ball handler and he can't shoot off the dribble. He tends to get out of control when trying to create shots - and he turns the ball over too much (2.9 per 40 PA). He is only a mediocre rebounder (9.0 per 40 pace adjusted - poor for a PF, good for a SF).
But Singleton is not a one-way player. He is an improving shooter, especially with his feet set. He improved his 3-point shooting last year to a passable 37% and his Free Throw shooting improved as well (68%).
So what have we got here? A player that can defend multiple positions. An OK rebounder for a wing. A player with an improving catch-and-shoot jump shot. High energy. High Basketball IQ. Good work ethic. Intense player with a passion for playing defense. Sounds to me like a definite role player... a 3 and D guy. But of course, if he makes that open corner 3-pointer almost automatic, he becomes so much more.
Singleton may have been the steal of the draft, but let's not heap tons of praise on Ernie Grunfeld for the pick. It was as easy a decision as John Wall was last year. It's hardly praiseworthy to pick a no-brainer.
Nonetheless, I give this pick a grade of A+
With the 34th pick in the 2011 NBA Draft, the Washington Wizards select Shelvin Mack
I actually didn't see this one coming. Everyone knows that I don't like undersized Shooting Guards in the starting line up... but that doesn't mean there is no place for one on the roster. Shelvin Mack is only 6'3", but he has very long arms and is extremely strong. He's an excellent athlete with a 39 inch vertical leap. He's got a high Basketball IQ and a good motor. Mack is a very tough player, built like a linebacker. (Mack - - I can definitely see someone coming up with a nick name there)
Very good at creating shots for himself. He has picture perfect shooting mechanics and has an excellent jump shot off the dribble. He has NBA three point range. He's very good in the pick and roll and an excellent ball handler. Defensively he is solid if not spectacular. His size may prove to be an issue if he guards NBA Shooting Guards. He generally keeps his man in front of him. He displays good court awareness.
At Butler, he played substantial minutes at the 2-guard spot, so the big question about him is can he play Point Guard; can he run an offense and create shots for others. In College, he was mostly a scoring guard. That's not to say that he didn't pass the ball. He made good decisions in the pick and roll, and occasionally showed good court vision. But he was not expected to create for his teammates at Butler. If he cannot make the transition to PG, then his value is lower, but he can still be a contributor off the bench. A good value at 34.
Grade for this pick = B
So if I were to sum up this draft, I'd say that the Wizards continued the theme from last year to get tougher, more athletic and more physical while adding high energy, and more intensity. All three players drafted yesterday are intelligent players with a sense of how to play the game (frequently called Basketball IQ).
They drafted three guys that play hard the entire game. Three intense guys with a will to win. Skill wise, there are some deficiencies. But if you're looking to change the culture of a losing team, these three players are certainly a step in the right direction.
Toughness = check.
Athleticism = check.
Intelligence = check.
Will to win = Check.
Experience = Check.
Skill = ????? TBD.
Overall grade for the Wizards 2011 Draft = solid B
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Curious...
Did Singleton play the P&R at all for FSU? Something I forgot to research…
by Bullet Nation in Exile on Jun 24, 2011 3:42 PM EDT reply actions
They didn't have a PG
their top assist man (3.6pg), Kitchen, isn’t even really a combo G and that’s why Singleton was forced into trying to create too much offense for himself this year.
Nice writeup.
Rook, I see you gave Vesely a B-, and I’ll admit to not being to high on the pick at the time. Then I got to thinking, considering who was available at 6, who would I take over Vesely? I’m not terribly sure who that would be. I’m not excited about Vesely, but I’ve come around to it as probably the right move.
So Rook, who would you have grabbed at 6 if you were EG?
The Washington Wizards: providing career scoring nights for unknown opposing bench players since 2004.
Vesely...
Given that Williams and Kanter were already gone, Vesely is the logical choice….
I believe he’s also the single biggest swing (upside vs bust) of any player in the draft… If he learns to dribble and shoot, the guy could be a multiple time All-Star… If not………………….
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
OK. We're on the exact same page then.
The Washington Wizards: providing career scoring nights for unknown opposing bench players since 2004.
Yeah I would've the other JV over Vesely.
if he was still on the board, but other than Biyombo (who I didn’t really like for us – but LOVE for Charlotte), I wouldn’t have considered anyone else that went in the top 15.
Mack Daddy works for me.
As far as Vesely’s shooting goes, I really think it’s his lack of practice. He admitted that he rarely worked on it as a professional in Europe. By looking at his form, it’s definitely there and I believe with NBA practices, coaches, workouts, etc., Jan will improve his shooting steadily year after year. He might shoot in the 60s at the FT line this year, but look for it to improve to the 70s in years 2 and 3 and hopefully around 80 when all is said and done. Practice, practice, practice really will help him.
I hope we use Mack exclusively as a PG.
I can’t wait for Singleton to develop a consistent 3 point shot.
I don’t expect too much in terms of production for Vesely in year 1, but do expect plenty of highlight dunks. I do expect him to be a good player and a starter for us in a couple years.
Be sure to read NBA Playbook's scouting report on Jan Vesley
http://www.bulletsforever.com/2011/6/24/2242398/nba-playbooks-scouting-report-on-jan-vesely
My swag was phenomenal.
11%FG off the dribble, 30%FG on catch-n-shoot, 18%FG in ISOs w/14% TO rate
well, I guess Jan needs to play PF!
Who's Hopla, here's Holger Geschwindner
Get Jan in the gym with the guy that made Nowitzki!
I like the Bullets
Grat article rook
I’d like to point out, though, that as the smallest guard in the rotation, SMack (how’s that for a nickname) will likely never be asked to guard 2s
by jones-y on Jun 24, 2011 3:46 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Sorry jones-y, but incorrect...
Mack played mostly off the ball at Butler this year… with Ronald Nored and Shawn Vanzant playing Point Guard….
Mack may have had more assists, but those came off pick-and-roll and the occasional drive… He was not the one initiating the offense. He was not the one with most of the ball handling duties. He was not the one playing PG… HE was the Shooting Guard for Butler….
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
Yeah,
but you can switch defensive assignments… The only player he might not switch assignments with is Crawford. But if he’s in with Wall or Young, I have a hard time seeing him guarding a SG that’s 3-4 inches taller than him.
SMack Truck. Coming to an opposing point guard near you.
I hear you...
.He doesn’t have to be Steve Nash… but it would be nice if the second unit has a guy that can run the offense, facilitate, create shots for his teammates, create shots for himself, and hit open shots…
I’m sure Mack can do the last two – and I’m hopeful he can do the first three…. We’ll see.
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
I like him from what I've read so far today.
The thing I like most is that he has heart to go with his skills. All the rest of that stuff will work itself out. I’m coming around to that on Vesely too.
As far as facilitating, the thing I like about adding Mack is that we already have our second string PG (Crawford) and he’s already proven to be a very capable facilitator and shot creator for others. So that means that Mack represents a major upgrade at third string PG, but more importantly, he will just be asked to come in and earn his minutes being a guard.
Mack played PG in college
Mack is a combo guard but he was the primary PG for Butler for three years, leading them in assists (3-3.5 per) if I remember. Backup NBA PG’s don’t have to be pure PG, the wiz can go combo guard very easily with the second rotation group. I wouldn’t call it “making a transition” for him to be a PG in the NBA, that has been his position.
Building a solid core
Honestly I’m happy with these last two years of draft picks. Seraphin, Booker, Wall, Vesely, Singleton, Mack. These guys are hard workers. The might not be polished, but what rookie is? They have a good coach in Flip and they’ll definitely grow because they all have the work ethic. They kind of remind me of the mentality Ozzy uses when he picks players for the Ravens (I still hesitate to give Ernie any credit after what he’s done to our team in the past).
Now if we can just be patient, bring in some veterans and give this team about three years to mesh, we’ll be back in the playoffs. Although I would have loved to get Enes, you have to work with what you have. Who knows, maybe in the future we’ll trade for him.
"I'm a star and the galaxy around me is dust and gas..." -Wale
A few questions
It would seem that Wall, Young (with heavy minutes from Crawford), Blatche and McGee are the starters.
Who do you have at the 3?
Where do Veseley and Singleton play and how much?
How many wins do you see with this roster?
Probably Rashard Lewis this season.
I think he’ll start but won’t get starters minutes, at least I hope. Need to get plenty of playing time for Vesely, Singleton, Booker.
by PhenomenalSwag on Jun 24, 2011 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions
If he isn't hurt, he will get starter mins
Remember he is still the best off threat of the 4. Only way he doesn’t get starter minutes is basically giving playing time to the other 3. This is why I think Vessely will be fighting fork minutes.
by DavidDunn on Jun 24, 2011 5:17 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I'd say Rashard has the starting Small Forward job
At least at the beginning of the year…
Look for Jan and Chris Singleton to share back-up duties… or if Shard gets injured, I’d expect Jan to be the starter…
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
Not positive. I get a sense that Singleton could
Push for minutes, Booker could get very hungry, or Flip could decide to go Wall/Crawford/young.
This draft really creates major competition in a lot of positions. I hope everyone has to earn their minutes. That mind set will be good to have built in as we improve over the next few years.
by DavidDunn on Jun 24, 2011 5:22 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Singleton is a better SF than Vesely.
I mean look at Jan’s shooting stats, they are so bad you almost think they can’t be true. Jan’s going to have to try his hand at PF, the skills for SF just arent there. And you really cant hold it against a 7’ player either, it’s not like there are other 7’ SFs out there and he’s the guy who doesnt cut it.
Plus, Singleton's defensive diversity really
Will make it tough for flip to not use to stop a run. Vessely really seems like Blatches back up to me while Singleton and Booker will come in based on need at 3 or 4 depending on the situation.
Let’s be real. We are playing Miami and it is late 3rd early 4th. Who is coming in to guard Lebron. Singleton, Vessely or Booker. I know one that isn’t even on the radar. (I guess Vessley could be an option if we go zone)
by DavidDunn on Jun 24, 2011 5:34 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Actually....
Let’s be real. We are playing Miami and it is late 3rd early 4th. Who is coming in to guard Lebron. Singleton, Vessely or Booker.
I actually like all three…
Singleton is 6’9" (same as LeBron) – and a stellar defender…. very active.
We all know Booker is strong, quick, agile and athletic.. He got much better defensively as the year went on…
I think everyone will be very surprised at how well Vesely plays defense on the perimeter against guys like D-Wade, LeBron and other slasher/drivers… Look at some film on defense here … He’s actually VERY good at staying in front of perimeter players—— even guards, as you can see in the video. Where he has trouble is DEFENDING IN THE POST…
So yeah – I’d love to see what Vesely can do against guys like LeBron – where he can play off several feet – take away the drive and still contest the shot with his size and length… Think about how Jarred Jeffries guarded Lebron… Like that.
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
by Rook6980 on Jun 24, 2011 8:09 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
That's my thinking too
I hope to see Singleton out there a lot at SF. Vesely is the skinny version of tweener. He’ll have to try to make it work at PF (and maybe even center), or get better at, um, basketball.
I disagree....
Vesely has been playing SF (and on the perimeter) for several years now in Europe. He was the point defender in Partizan’s defense (at the foul line most of the time).. guarding the perimeter players (Guards, and Small Forwards)… He very rarely was asked to guard big men….
Opponent coaches used to force him down low by putting in a big SF or big SG and have them post up, because Vesely is not as good in the post… (Lack of bulk)…
But he’s a good perimeter defender.
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
by Rook6980 on Jun 24, 2011 8:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah I saw some analysis (and video) of his perimeter defense
There was a whole lot to like there…
From what I have read and have watched in the little video available to me
Jan is pretty good on the post on offense. It is interesting that he isn’t able to use the same feet and positioning skills on the other end. I hope with some instruction and weight program that can be improved.
by DavidDunn on Jun 24, 2011 11:59 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
We'll have to agree to disagree
I worry based on what little I’ve seen (including your link above – thanks!) about his ability to stay close to NBA perimeter players. I like that he makes people shoot long jumpers in front of him (smart), but he gives up a lot of space, and isn’t keeping up with guys that are step slower than their NBA counterparts. In that clip, much shorter guys are easily getting 15-20 footers off over him — they’re just missing badly.
He also doesn’t do anything on offense that you want a SF to do. He can’t shoot, can’t pass, and can’t dribble or drive. He’s better in the post, from what I’ve seen.
by steadyhand on Jun 25, 2011 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Well he's a great matchup for the Kevin Durants, Rudy Gays, and Nick Batums
The comparatively smaller guys (Pierce, Butler) will probably out-bang him. He’s a great matchup for the taller guys.
But the guys he was guarding in the analysis footage were SFs over there. Their NBA counterparts are taller, bigger and stronger. In the NBA those guys in that footage are SGs.
So what you’re really seeing his is weakness guarding quicker 6’6-6’7 players on the perimeter (and his strengths posting them up). You expect that from a 7 footer. That’s Durant’s scouting report too.
B- for Vesley?
I feel like that’s too low given the choices we had. Not like we could take Brandon Knight, or Kemba. So that leaves the alternatives to be Bismack or other combo guards that were taken afterwards… So given the choices we have seems like Wizards did the perfect job, which should be an A unless you think we should have taken one of the Morris twins… or Leonard.
The Spurs traded George Hill to get Leonard
always feels ominous when you dont take a guy the Spurs wanted
Perhaps
Its hard to call it without seeing what the rest of their offseason looks like, but
1) leonard has to be an absolute monster in their system to justify this trade straight up (because GHill is an absolute monster in their system), and
2) Parker is on the trading block, so trading his backup makes zero sense.
This trade has to be a part of a much larger retooling to make sense. Either they’re keeping Parker for the long haul and preparing to lose Manu, or they have a trade in the works for a Rondo level PG (anything lower is a crossgrade), or they’re making a run at Chris Paul. If none of the above, then they blundered. And it can’t be that they’re entering a rebuilding phase, because if so, then George Hill is the player you keep.
they wanted a lotto pick for Parker and didnt get it
I’m assuming that means now they are keeping him since they traded Hill.
But think what they see in Leonard that they traded Hill for him? Kid was in our gym, looked good, and we went another direction. Rondo was in our gym once and Ernie went with Pech.
Will be interesting to see how it pans out.
I have a hard time seeing this as a net positive for them in the short to mid term.
If the upside of this trade is 2-3 years in the future, then that implies a rebuild (or at least a retool). And like I said, George Hill is the player you keep if that’s the case.
Unless Leonard is a beast from day one. Or unless Parker is staying and they’re bringing in another guard. Or unless they have that much faith in Gary Neal (that’s really the only real possibility IMO: they think Neal is on the verge of a breakout).
I have a hard time seeing Pop ok’ing this, and I can’t see Pop being happy with this. Any way you cut it, losing Hill is a HUGE blow to their backcourt.
Some people are still trashing EG, even after yesterday’s draft. Because of his reputation. People are digging SA’s trade yesterday. Because of their reputation. Redact the names and look at Grunfeld’s draft. Then do the same and look at SA’s trade…
by jones-y on Jun 24, 2011 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm trashing EG because he used the 6th pick on a 7' SF who will have to play PF
but is rail thin and doesnt rebound.
my guess is they do think Neal is a player….and that Pops will be happy with Leonard’s defense and rebounding, it is Pops we’re talking afterall. Still, making that move for Kawhi seems drastic, $$$ for Hill must have been involved as DDunn said
I didn't like Vesely at first either but
I’m starting to come around…
What I didn’t know is that he looks quick enough to keep NBA 3’s in front of him on defense, he has the beginnings of a spot up jumper, and he has the makings of a GREAT post game against 3’s on offense.
He needs two offseasons of weights, dribbling and shooting (HOPLAAAAAAAAA), but he can contribute over the course that period as a back to the basket SF (what 3 in the NBA can guard a 7 footer in the post?) and an energy defender.
Vesely will play SF for the Wizards...
He’s quick enough to stay in front of NBA Small Forwards (most of them anyway)…
Watch this defense video
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
by Rook6980 on Jun 24, 2011 8:14 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
In that video...
You see Vesely playing defense on the perimeter against smaller, quick players.. (Mostly guards in this video)…. and he displays quick feet.. and he gives the proper amount of space to deter the drive… but is long enough, and quick enough to get back to a shooter to contest…
Another thing to watch, he never stops moving… he’s always doing something, always active…
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
couple rec league guards there
and look again at 47sec in the defensive clip, Random gets like 3ft of separation on Jan with a just a slight acceleration toward hoop, a nothing move creates that much space with defender…nba players wil devour that, how much space would nick create there?
checkout same clip at 1:07…jan is run over from invisible contact by a non-descript D2 collegiate. Just trampled like he wasn’t there, and that’s in the highlight clip somehow.
Well they won't get past him.
The things to look for are the tools, not the outcomes. His lateral quickness, activity, etc. The techniques, and thus the outcomes, will improve over time.
He’s so long and quick, that NBA 3’s are going to have a tough time getting past him AND shooting over him. If they create space for pull up jumpers, then that’s an outcome you can live with (that’s the shot you want Nick Young taking), as opposed to getting past him and breaking down the offense for an easy bucket.
I could see him forcing a lot of pull up jumpers against NBA 3’s. That’s the shot you would prefer them taking .
by jones-y on Jun 25, 2011 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm looking at the same things as you, just seeing something different.
Different folks have different reads on these film breakdowns….so I’ll ask, can you think of any legit 7’ SFs in league history? 7’ player that can consistently guard the nba perimeter without being abused by quicker players? I cant think of anyone. So Jan is going to be the first, he’s THAT special? I will hope for the best, but I see no evidence to suggest that’s what will happen.
The worst shot in basketball is a 2-point jumper off the dribble...
Vesely doesn’t give up drives to the bucket…
He doesn’t give up wide open 3’s
He doesn’t allow spot up shooters room to elevate.
Small Forwards cannot post him up…
He gives up 2-point jumpers, off the dribble… the worst shot in basketball…. and most of the time, those shots are CONTESTED…
Very occasionally (and by that, I mean maybe once every couple games) , I saw him beat when he turned his head, and his man made a hard cut to the basket…. but EVERY player gets beat that way occasionally – even NBA First Team All Defensive guys….
I still have my subscription to EUROLEAGUE.TV and I’ve gone back and watched a couple Partizan games. I intend to watch all of them, and file an article specifically about Vesely’s defense when I’m done…
But so far, from what I remember watching the first time around, and the couple games I’ve rewatched yesterday, he’s very quick on defense.. even when matched up against smaller, quicker players like Guards (even Point Guards)… He does give room, probably an extra foot or two than normal. He discourages any drive to the middle…. while forcing drives to the outsides – He makes his man shoot a 2-point shot OFF THE DRIBBLE – from mid-range (17-19 feet typically)- and Yeah – sometimes they actually go in… but more often, it’s a miss… I’ll have a full report on Vesely’s perimeter defense, post defense, help defense, zone defense and other observations after I’m done watching the 20 or so games from the 2009-10 and 2010-11 seasons… Keep in mind that it may take a while, as I’m watching now not as a fan, but more like a scout, stopping video, rewinding, taking notes, etc… So don’t look for it any time soon…. but I’m working on it…
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
by Rook6980 on Jun 25, 2011 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Awesome
I look forward to it. I do like how he takes the smart approach of forcing guys to shoot the jumper. I just see those guys so easily creating space and worry how much damage NBA players can do with that much space.
Can't wait!
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 26, 2011 9:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Young KG played SF in Flip's zone.
KG measured in at 6’-11" in socks, same as Vesely. KG was still a teenager and still growing when the measurement was taken.
During the World Championships last summer, the commentators said that Durant is 6’-11" in socks now.
Jared Jeffries and Austin Daye are seven footers, depending on their choice of footwear.
durant was 6'9" at his combine, doesnt look 7' to me.
I didnt realize KG played fulltime SF at some point in his career.
They apperently didn't want to pay Hill
by DavidDunn on Jun 24, 2011 5:23 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Then they have to continue to pay Parker.
Or rebuild.
I think you're overrating George Hill a bit
I’d still pay Parker over him even at his age. Parker’s not that old himself.
I think they’re hoping to dump Jefferson and make Leonard their SF of the future, and Bertans is intriguing to them.
I actually am struggling to figure this one out for Indiana. Where will Hill get minutes with Collison and George there? If they traded the pick for a third guard – I mean that’s ok but I think they can eventually find a third guard some other time. Then again, they didn’t need Leonard.
I’m guessing San Antonio loved Leonard and acted once he saw them sliding.
by Mike Prada on Jun 24, 2011 7:07 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I'd prefer Parker too. That's not what I'm saying.
I’m just struggling to put the trade into context.
For Indy, Hill is a MAJOR upgrade at backup PG, and with his defensive intensity, he can steal some smallball minutes at the 2. You can make minutes for Hill. But most of all, TJ Ford can quietly slide into ‘distant memory’ territory… I personally love this trade for them. It addresses a real need, and its a nice bench upgrade.
I think that Indy thinks that now is their time to make a push. With the new CBA it should be hard for them to make a push with their owner’s wallet (which is what Bird wanted), so they need to find smart, responsible upgrades wherever they can.
The context for San Antonio is that they figured four years of Leonard at the rookie scale is better than giving Hill an extension
I suppose you’re right about Indiana’s angle though – there probably is time for all three, and this was a crappy draft.
Yeah - everyone will have a difference of opinion....
but my grade reflects my disappointment that the Wizards couldn’t move up to grab Williams (an almost certain Star) or Kanter (an almost certain double-double guy)…
It has less to do with picking Vesely
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
by Rook6980 on Jun 24, 2011 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
oh well in that sense
I guess it makes sense
I was also hoping we got Kanter or Williams
and was praying we were pulling a trade with Utah when they picked Kanter, which I still don’t understand unless they firmly believed Kanter was going to be that much more better than millsap,jefferson, and favors
by Young Wook Lee on Jun 24, 2011 7:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Rook, noting many of our's disappointment with picking 6th...
…and with hindsight, what would you have been willing to trade to move up for the 2nd pick? the 3rd pick?
follow-up question, if you see these...
It’s rumored that EG had targeted Vesley long ago. Where do you think Vesley was on the Wizard’s draft board? At what pick (5, 4, 3…) would the Wizards have chosen someone other than Vesley? And do you think EG believes Vesley can improve his shooting, or do you think EG feels Vesley is still a great prospect even if he doesn’t? Thanks!
Before the draft...
I was willing to trade the #6 and #18 picks to move up to get D. Williams at #2, or Kanter at #3… (of course, at the time, I didn’t know that Singleton would be available at 18. Had I known, it may have changed my thinking)…
At one point, I was willing to trade JaVale McGee straight up for the #2 pick..
I was also willing to trade the #6 to Utah and take on Okur’s $10 Million contract for the #3….
AT NO POINT was I willing to trade away any future picks…. and especially not the 2012 first round pick.
As for your second question – and I have no direct knowledge… but I believe that the Wizards draft board was probably:
D. Williams
E. Kanter
J. Vesely
J. Valanciunas
B. Biyombo
I’d bet that Valanciunas was higher BEFORE we learned of his buy-out situation….
I used to have super powers until my psychiatrist took them away.
by Rook6980 on Jun 25, 2011 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Thanks,
I agree with pretty much everything you say here. I do think it’s a bit funny that everyone says EG was targeting Van since very early in the process, but maybe that’s just because he figured the other guys ahead of him on their draft board would be gone.
Thanks for all the draft analysis and articles going way back to the season. It’s one of the great things about this site.
I can picture the fast breaks now
Wall crossing mid court in the blink of an eye looking to set up one of his guys, Vesely, Mcgee, and Singleton dissapearing from the man assigned to guard them only to be seen on the other side of the court presumably instantly, waiting for the alley ooop!, all the while, Nick Young casually floating towards the three point line in the corner.
Flip on the sideline, “WTF??! None of you dumbasses grabbed the rebound, somebody go pass the damn ball in, and if you give up another offensive rebound, I am benching your ass for Larry Owens.”
Ohhh my God.
Where is my FACE? I CANT FEEL MY FACE!!!
by returnofswagger on Jun 24, 2011 4:12 PM EDT reply actions 9 recs
LOL LOL
"My logic fails all the time...especially when talking to females" Rook6980
"I'll be lounging on the couch, just chillin in my snuggie, klick to MTV so they can teach my how to dougie" (Buno Mars, The lazy song)
by Dutch Hoopfan on Jun 24, 2011 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Theoretically
Singleton, Booker, Mcgee, and Vesely should be deadly on the fast break. John Wall’s blistering speed with the ball, along with these guy’s crazy athleticism and speed, we should be looking to run constantly.
And honestly, I am willing to say John Wall is one of the best players, in transition, in the league. He doesn’t need a full on fastbreak. Just catching the D still setting up, I saw him really take advantage of opportunities last year. I cringed when I watched him slow up and try to run a play sometimes. When he has a guy moving backward on their heels, there is not much the defender can do. Pair that with the athleticism of Booker, Mcgee, and Vesely, and the pure SPEED of Booker and Singleton, and Shewww. That is a recipe for success.
But really, we did not get to see that nearly enough last season, and I fear the same problems will carry over. Not enough stops made on D(this one might improve), nobody to grab defensive rebounds, and not the right decisions being made after a guy does grab the board. Ball needs to go straight to the PG. No quick second thoughts about whether or not you should dribble up the court yourself (Javale!). The outlet pass should be practiced, and practiced, and practiced some more by our bigs. Because they are the key to our fastbreak offense this year.
Ohhh my God.
Where is my FACE? I CANT FEEL MY FACE!!!
by returnofswagger on Jun 24, 2011 11:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
With 2min left in a close game..
I know who won’t be on the floor with a FT% of 54. I really hope that drastically gets better.
by AnyGiven on Jun 24, 2011 5:04 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Great stuff Rook.
We got longer and faster. Hope that means something. Potential line up.
Wall-6’5"
Young 6’7"
Vessely 7"0’
Blatche 6’11"
McGee 7’1"
Woah. Highly dependent on dray showing up on off and McGee and Vessely Rebounding.
A zone with that group could be a monster if they worked.
On Vessely, I thinky biggest concern remains his shooting and hands. If he doesn’t have large or strong hands, that could be the issue with his ball handling. Seeing some droppped rebs in limited video is why that stays high ont radar. I know you said you didn’t see that in game, so I am hoping the video was an anomaly.
Thanks for writing this up.
by DavidDunn on Jun 24, 2011 5:29 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
I think this will be our depth chart, at least to start the season (2nd positions in parens)
PG: Wall, Mack (Crawford)
SG: Young, Crawford, Jeffers (Mack, Owens)
SF: Lewis, Singleton, Owens (Jeffers, Booker, Vesely)
PF: Blatche, Vesely, Booker (Seraphin, Lewis, Singleton)
C: McGee, Seraphin, N’Daiye (Blatche)
Maybe Vesely can play SF, but the scouting reports suggest not yet. Ditto Booker.
Seraphin is forced to play center because we don’t have a backup.
Hopefully Singleton overtakes Lewis during the season.
Interestingly, we might see several minutes per game of Blatche at center
Which will open some more minutes at SF and PF for the younger set.
Of course, Blatche and McGee are very capable of opening up lots of minutes by playing terribly.
I was just throwing a future line up out there.
I think Lewis starts next year if nothing else for some veteran presence. He does the right things on the floor. Plus, he is an offensive threat when not hurt. I also expect him to get more minutes than others expect.
by DavidDunn on Jun 24, 2011 7:08 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
That line up also shows why Booker was
Confused. He has some hard work in front of him.
by DavidDunn on Jun 24, 2011 7:10 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
yeah for real
i gotta think a trade or something is in the works… if we could only deal rashard lewis and andray blatche for draft picks next year haha
bring back darvin ham
If there's an amnesty clause in the new CBA, Rashard could be gone
That opens up minutes for Booker.
PG: Wall, Mack
SG: Young, Crawford, Jeffers
SF: Vesely, Singleton, Owens
PF: Blatche, Booker, Seraphin
C: McGee, N’Diaye
We would probably try to find a FA center. If we can get a wily vet who is willing to be a mentor, that would be ideal. If we can’t, I would be OK with bringing Yi back for cheap, since he works hard, knows the system, and still has some upside potential.
Amnesty clause
What is an amnesty clause? I’ve seen several posters mention it as some sort of magic wand that wipes Rashard’s contracts off our books. If it was this simple, wouldn’t every team use it to get rid of their deadweight contracts (e.g. Baron Davis, Gilbert)?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allan_Houston#.22Allan_Houston_Rule.22
Something similar is expected to happen this time around, too. If we can clear Rashard’s salary off our books for cap/tax purposes, we’ll have space to offer big contracts to free agents. With teams like the Lakers and Mavs forced to cut players to get under a new hard cap (using the amnesty where possible), there should be plenty of free agents to pick from, some of whom could be very good players.
by yop32 on Jun 26, 2011 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'll bet
EG finds a way to deal Shard. Maybe packaged up with 7day.
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.
That's the definition of wishful thinking...
Highly unlikely that any team takes both our worst contract (the 2nd worst in the league, mind you) and our biggest headache.
true
so Shart ought to be slightly easier to move. Besides he’s less of a head-case than Gil, is more likely to be looked at as Veteran help in a stretch-run. I bet we move him this season if we have a season.
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.
Artest went 16th too
and Singleton is taller and not a headcase.
Vesely is Kirilenko but trade some shot creation ability for more athleticism.
Mack could be the next Kyle Lowry
Good article Rook
I too am dissapointed we were’nt able to move up that’s just what it is I guess.
The funny thing is the picks before us could not have gone any worse for us imo. Williams, Kanter Valanciunas and Thompson were all better picks than Vesely at # 6 but none of the PG’s (Knight and Kemba) nor a extreme reach Jimmer, Biyombo) was picked in the top 5.
Still, I had Leonard and Singleton on my board over Vesely so Imho Jan was not the clear cut BPA at that point. Burks could have also been considered here imo but pending NY’s re-signing it wasn’t a direct need.
All in all, after a year of losing 38 out of 41 road games, losing 59 games overall and going through sooooo many frustrating dissapointments, it just doesn’t feel as if it was worth it. Much of that has to do with all the dropouts and the bad luck at the lottery. Two things we can’t control, I know.
I dunno, its just…unsatisfactory ( is that even an english word?!)
"My logic fails all the time...especially when talking to females" Rook6980
"I'll be lounging on the couch, just chillin in my snuggie, klick to MTV so they can teach my how to dougie" (Buno Mars, The lazy song)
So glad everyone has settled down
with the negativity!!!! I thought I was in second grade again and no one wanted to do nap time.
Its not like there was really a better PROVEN option over Jan.
And then Dave Aldridge and most of the “experts” have given Washington a great grade as far as the draft goes. Everything else is to be determined.
I think the anger from most people here yesterday (at least coming from me)
was not really due to the fact that we took JV (although there are those that wanted Bismack, Leonard, or Singleton there instead of him), it was more due to the fact that we didn’t make a play to get Kanter or Williams. It came out after everything that the asking price was too high to move up, and after it came out that we would have had to give 6+18+next year’s 1st(!) I am extremely glad that we didn’t. But, as the 6th pick was announced, I (and I’m pretty sure many others here), with what knowledge we had, were angry that we did not move up to get someone who many believe will become a better player and would fit in to this team better than JV.
After all the facts have come out, I’m pretty happy with how everything turned out, especially with Singleton falling to us at 18. We still can’t forget, though, that there are still major deficiencies in d rebounding and interior defense. With Kanter we could have fixed a lot of those deficiencies, but now we will have to wait until next year (Sullinger??).
by Joe_G on Jun 24, 2011 9:42 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
When they announced Vesely,
I was disappointed a little, but then I said ok, let’s see if they announce a trade… So I’m sittin there waiting, and shooting the shit with my friends, and before I knew it, NY had made their pick and it wasn’t Singleton… Man, I almost shatted myself…
Anyway, during the interlude between the two picks, I kept thinking to myself “BF must be on FIRE right about now. I’ll pass…” Kinda like I do after bad losses. Just avoiding the negativity.
So anyway, last night when I got home, I started checking out Vesely a little closer, rereading all the scouting reports that I had skimmed, checking all the videos I had skipped. And it helped even me out. That and the fact that the national analysts liked our draft. But today, after having some time to digest, think over the roster, read more analysis and watch more video, I feel really good about Vesely. Especially after I saw him playing perimeter D and posting up SFs
But I understand the instant reactions. That’s why we’re called fans… I’m just even keeled by nature…
by jones-y on Jun 24, 2011 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
i think that describes the night for most of us here.
"Blake Griffin is the American Jan Vesely" - Jan Vesely
by PhenomenalSwag on Jun 24, 2011 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions
I can feel that
Thanks for the insight (no sarcasm)
I personally figured that people would be flipping out more, to be honest, so I'm proud of everyone
Though I admittedly only skimmed the second thread.
I wonder if trade-up was possible with Utah
I wonder if both Minnesota and Utah demanded 6+18+next year’s 1st. Ted’s blog and Ernie’s comments state that this was the price the Wizards were asked to pay in order to trade up. But neither said that this was requested by both teams. My guess – and it’s just a guess – is that Minnesota asked for this when the Wizards made it clear they wouldn’t give up McGee. I think Utah, on the other hand, would have been satisfied with 6, 18 and Okur’s K because, first of all, Utah is run by more competent and realistic hands than Minnesota, second because it would have given Utah three picks in the first 18 where they could have landed Brandon Knight, Alec Burks and Chris Singleton, and third because it would free up cap space for them to sign Kirilenko (assuming they’re interested in resigning him). I could be totally wrong about this but I’m skeptical that Utah demanded the exact same price as Minnesota.
Someone reported
That Kanter was number one on Utah’s draft board, so moving up to their pick might have been even more costly than Minnesota’s. Who knows if that’s true, but that’s their line.
Overt
AverageBro.com - @AverageBro
by averagebro on Jun 24, 2011 10:37 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Robert Horry as a Rookie is the best Vesely comparable.
I’m sorta shocked nobody has picked up on the similarity. Horry was a high flying, non shooting, high IQ energy guy as a rookie. He was supposed to revolutionize the PF position but never developed offensively, other than a strange lust for three pointers. Before he became Big Shot Rob, he was a raw offensive player with incredible physical talents.
As a rookie, this is precisely who Vesely reminds me of. What he develops into remains to be seen.
AverageBro.com - @AverageBro
by averagebro on Jun 24, 2011 10:42 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
That actually is kind of interesting
When did Horry learn to shoot well? I’m asking, not telling.
They used to sometimes run him into the post against smaller 3s too.
That's going back a ways
But I seem to remember thinking of young Horry as a well-rounded player and great defender. Much more like Singleton than Vesely.
I'll take Vesely as an evolutionary Big Shot Rob
And smile all day long.
Horry didnt become a one dimensional chucker....
….until his 4th season in the NBA.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/horryro01.html
Before that, the Rockets played him mostly at the 3, and tried to groom him as a 4 to replace Otis Thorpe. His post game never really developed, but he was a solid defender even as a rookie. Like Vesely, he was a raw, skinny player who was all arms and legs.
The legend of Big Shot Rob didn’t really develop until years later when he became a Laker. In the middle was a bad stint in PHX during which he threw a towel at his coach and a rescinded trade to DET.
AverageBro.com - @AverageBro
We can only hope
that Vesely is as good as Horry someday. Big Shot Bob was awesome.
Right now, all we have is just “Big Kiss Jan”
by DC1 on Jun 25, 2011 9:25 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Everything
points to this guy at least having some balls. That counts for something.
by Marine4Life51 on Jun 25, 2011 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions

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