Report: Wizards acquiring Hinrich, 17th pick from Bulls
by Mike Prada on Jun 24, 2010 3:50 PM EDT
in Trades
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PrintRic Bucher has the scoop:
The Chicago Bulls have a deal in place that would move Kirk Hinrich and the 17th pick to theWashington Wizards, freeing up enough cap space to pursue two maximum-salary players on this summer's free-agent market, sources with knowledge of the Bulls' plans said Thursday.
It wasn't immediately clear what Washington would send to Chicago in the trade.
Hinrich has two years and $17 million remaining on his contract. He'll make $9 million this year and $8 million in 2011/12.
My initial reaction is that I hate this trade. The point of BOYD is to get guys with one year left, not guys with two years left. We have much less flexibility in 2011 now, which really hurts going into the new CBA. Also, I was hoping we wouldn't get yet another combo guard. We now currently employ John Wall, Gilbert Arenas, Kirk Hinrich and (for the moment) Shaun Livingston.
But at least we did get the 17th pick, I guess.
UPDATE: Um, this is weird. From the same article.
Since it's a good-faith deal for the time being, there remains a chance it could fall apart. But according to one source, the Sacramento Kings are prepared to make a similar deal with the Bulls in the Wizards' stead if that were to happen.
Please fall apart.
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That would be interesting
I think things are still in flux today.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions
wow
I never thought about that but your right
by Kevon Robinson on Jun 24, 2010 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions
It'd be hilarious to flip Hinrich for hte 10th pick
Oh, God, way too good to be true, even fi we took back Ford.
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by pantslessyoda1 on Jun 24, 2010 6:49 PM EDT up reply actions
im a wizards fan living in chicago and
this trade doesnt seem to make that much sense for either team. the bulls are acting like they already signed lebron, and im not sure wat the wizards want with this many guards
The NBA: Where Donaghy Happens.
Or another quality guy
Johnson at 10 million and Lebron at 15 is viable. Maybe they sign Ray Allen and add a big or trade for Varejao now.
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by pantslessyoda1 on Jun 24, 2010 6:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Well...
We have not had any chance of re-signing Livingston since the minute we got the John Wall pick and Heinrich seems like a pretty decent 3rd guard and a good fit for Flip Saunders’ offense.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions
ur
You’re assuming he’ll be here for both years. After 1 he becomes a good player AND an expiring contract.
also
For that 2nd year there might be a lockout.
by Johnnie Futbol on Jun 24, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
EXACTLY
Even if we just let him expire, Ted’s said that he wants to build through to draft. I’d write off any major free agent signings, at least for a while. Hell, even if we had cap space in 2011, who would we use it on? Melo’s going to sign an extension and CP3 plays the same position as our franchise player (who we could still deal for him in a sign and trade that wouldn’t be affected by cap space anyways).
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by pantslessyoda1 on Jun 24, 2010 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions
This team is not going to do a one year turn around
plus we can’t get that bent out of shape over one year.
I'd rather have Orton
Just someone over 6’10 and who weighs more than 240 pounds. We really need Brendan Haywood 2.0.
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by pantslessyoda1 on Jun 24, 2010 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Well
WHy don’t we try and trade Hinrich and our 35th and possibly 30th to the Pacers for the 10th
actually only if we give up either 30 or 35
by rayallenisaballer on Jun 24, 2010 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions
thats true
but the Pacers want a guard.
by Kevon Robinson on Jun 24, 2010 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I know
thats why I said we give up Kirk and #30 and #35.
The Pacers want a guard if they give up #10
by Kevon Robinson on Jun 24, 2010 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions
i meant give up kirk and only give up either 30 or 35.
by rayallenisaballer on Jun 24, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions
and Hinrich's got that NBA skin abnormality that they love in indiana
see: Murphy, Troy; Dunleavy, Mike; Foster, Jeff; Hansborough, Tyler;
by John Park Williams on Jun 24, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
umm
I see what you are saying but if this happens then we would just have the same amount
Before- #1, #30, and #35
After- #1, #10, and #17
by Kevon Robinson on Jun 24, 2010 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions
id shit my pants if he pulls off 1, 10 and 17
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah
I would trade the 30th/35th for the 10th. So I would totally trade the 30th/35th for the 10th/17th plus expiring contract.
The Pacers would only deal 10th to help get below lux tax
Right? so then taking on hinrichs contract makes zero sense
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions
We'd take back
Dunleavy and send 2 million in cash. They save 2.2 million, get a few picks, plus the PG they really want.
Do they really want to trade Dunleavy?
Larry Bird might not be able to field an all-white team without him
just hope
Ernie is thinking like we are.
by Kevon Robinson on Jun 24, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd rather have the tenth than the 35th and 30th
Any day. Heck, I’d trade the 17th and 30th for the 10th. Lots of picks is important, but I’d rather have quality than quantity. We need 12 players, but only 8 or 9 will play meaningful minutes. Tenth picks are usually solid starters, occasionally you get a Butler, Iggy, or other borderline all-star.
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by pantslessyoda1 on Jun 24, 2010 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I know Chicago has been trying to move Hinrich for awhile now....
If we do keep him, I really do not see Livingston coming back. Any word as to if we are giving up anybody? I’ve heard Nick Young’s name floating around (as he would obviously be the odd man out)
So let me get this straight
Peja’s contract is one year at 13 million. The Hornets have the 11th pick.
Heinrich’s contract is two years @ 17 million a year. The Bulls have the 17th pick.
Fire EG.
How do you know what the Hornets were asking back in return?
by ccrun1800 on Jun 24, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The 18th pick just went for a 2nd and 2.1 million.
They are thinking about moving Chris Paul to clear space. A report came out that Mo Pete’s contract may get the 11th. No way they turn down Peja’s.
So 4 million
In value to the Heat. Plus the 2nd. Say the 2nd is worth 2 million. So 6 million. Do you really think 7 spots aren’t worth 7 million to such a money strapped franchise?
You can only pay up to 3 million for a draft pick
The Shanahan era is going to bring the Redskins back to Glory! Great QB and an actual O-line.
I think we could still do that
Plus, Hinrich’s is 17 million over two years, not 17 million a year.
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by pantslessyoda1 on Jun 24, 2010 6:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Yuck
Hopefully this is a precursor to another trade.
by BayAreaBullet on Jun 24, 2010 3:59 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
really? am I the only one that likes this trade?
by John Park Williams on Jun 24, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions
If this is indeed it
then yes.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I like the trade as well
We’re getting a mid-first round pick in a strong draft in exchange for taking on a decent-but-somewhat-overpaid player that we can easily afford. This is BOYD…I don’t understand why people are against it. Hinrich’s contract is downward-trending too, which is great.
This is a weak draft
Maybe average. I would not call it strong.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I think we can get
a better player than young and mcgee at 17 this year. Seems deep to me
I like the trade
We aren’t getting a big FA this season, and it is the perfect offseason to get high draft picks because other teams are dying to get rid of their average/high paid players
The Shanahan era is going to bring the Redskins back to Glory! Great QB and an actual O-line.
So
I was reading the article.
and someone’s comment was:
“the trade wont be official for two weeks”
and im curious as to whether this person was flat out wrong, or why this would be so
So how will this work?
We tell them who to pick, they make the selection, then we make the trade offical on July 1st?
And we can't really flip Heinrich tonight for something else
In that case, correct?
no we could
it still wouldn’t be official until July 8
by Johnnie Futbol on Jun 24, 2010 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions
uh
Maybe I was wrong….. and should have waited a few more minutes before I denegrated Ernie’s lack of action this draft season…
First Childress, and now Hinrich and the #17 pick?
I guess Ernie HAS been on the phone.
Bullets Forever - where "Dagger ! " happens......
Big Ern
Clearly wants to bring back players we can actually use and not just filler. Heinrich and Childress fit with Ted’s plan.
Yep thats exactly what I am thinking to
Remember we are talking about the maturation of John wall as well and you need a solid veteran team to counter act some of the knuckle heads we have all ready employed.
I only hate it if this is the only move
If they can use the 17 to move up, then I can live with Heinrich. He’s solid if unspectacular, and I never thought Livingston was going to sign anywhere he was going to come off the bench. If they can also trade for another pick in the 20s then the 2 year contract won’t seem so bad.
by Elvin_is_my_Elvis on Jun 24, 2010 4:05 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
there had been a rumor
before this trade of indy and chicago swapping the 10th and 17th picks and heinrich, so maybe that’s still a possibility
John Hollinger via twitter
I don’t think he really gets this trade but:
OKC swallowed $2 million to get the 18th pick. Wash swallowed $17 million to get 17th pick. Quick quiz: Which team is run better?
if we keep heinrich then he is right because he is not bringing us a championship- he’s a nice backup. under that scenario, i would pay 2m and trade up 10-15 spots.
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Hollinger fails to take into account
That we also got Kirk Heinrich, who is a proven starting-caliber player for 2 years. Eric Maynor may or may not be a backup caliber player. So it’s not really an apples-to-apples comparison.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions
What does adding a 29 year old starting-caliber player mean
to a team that is at least three years from being a contender?
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Unless you are arguing that he brings veteran presence
but the Michael Ruffins of the world can do that too and for a whoooole lot less money
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Seems like Ernie's hedging between rebuild and reload
Wants to have us on the playoff bubble in year one of the rebuilding process. Which is counterproductive because to be on the playoff bubble you have to use resources that you could have used to acquire picks/youth to acquire vets, and being on the playoff bubble hurts your draft chances.
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Pretty much sums it up
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Sums up EG's last 3 years.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
You don't win championships with the Heinrichs of the world playing major roles
Of course, we aren’t even close to a championship in the next two years. Explain why you don’t mind spending 17 Mil over two years?
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, you also don't win championships paying 9 mil per year to a backup
I’m responding to Joseph’s post lauding Heinrich as a starting caliber player. So yes, in Joseph’s hypothetical Heinrich WILL be playing a major role. But either way, I don’t see the point of taking him on.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Right
And when the Wizards are in contention to win a championship in 2-3 years Hinrich’s contract will be up.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions
So you're basically conceding
That Hinrich is a placeholder for a 17 Mil purchase of the 17th pick in the draft. That’s called overpaying.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions
John Hollinger via twitter
“Recanting last Tweet re:Wizards pending further information; I’m told there may be other considerations involved.”
Good sign
by forthepeople on Jun 24, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions
If EG gets more
I will apologize for calling for him to be fired.
Is it possible
They have a deal in place to move Gilbert? Kirk is his replacement?
NOOOOOO
Every move people think is a sign we are moving Arenas. We are not moving Arenas and this has nothing to do with Arenas.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions
It is a lot of money to pay for a player that will sit behind two players likely to get 35 mins per game.
by Johnnie Futbol on Jun 24, 2010 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Right
but we aren’t going to win an award for spending the fewest dollars this season. We need to field a team and Heinrich is a solid, versatile, smart player whose contract will be up when it’s time to pay Blatche/McGee.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions
But the idea is to use those cap dollars in the most effective way
Thus this trade is better than signing someone off the street for Heinrich’s salary, but not as good as trading for someone with one year left on their contract.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Unless Ernie wants to field a team thats on the playoff bubble
at the same time the Wizards are rebuilding. Perhaps because a Wizards team with Wall that finishes a few games out of the 8th spot this season helps his job security even though it hurts rebuilding process.
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Doesn't help his job security with Leonsis at the helm.
My guess is Ted will eventually get rid of EG – hopefully before next offseason.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Ok, so how would he have spent that money more effectively?
Remember, the roster needs a backup PG and a solid “3rd guard” for depth behind Wall/Arenas and Hinrich is BOTH and he came with a 1st round pick and he’s only under contract for 2 years.
Frankly, I’m starting to think that 2 years, $17M could be just as effective use of cap space as the 4 year, $16M that it would cost for a veteran backup PG.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions
No the roster does not need that
We don’t need to build this roster in one year. I’d be perfectly happy signing D-Leaguers to fill those spots.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Amen
Its a rebuilding team. That means you are not trying to field the best team that you can. You are trying to field a young team, and create the opportunity to bring in more youth and talent by keeping as much cap space available as you can. A rebuilding team doesn’t have expensive veterans.
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You know what breeds winning?
Winning. And veterans who know how to win in the league. And someone was going to have to be the 3rd guard and the Wizards now have a good one for this season instead of a D-leaguer. They have the cap space to absorb it.
He’s under contract for TWO years, it’s not a long term contract. That’s a nice expiring contract next season or a nice 3rd guard next season.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions
I just don't think that
30-52 breeds winning anymore than 20-62.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Exactly
30-52 gets you a worse draft pick and not much more.
Look to OKC and Sacto as examples… they embraced sucking, and as a result they’re developing/have developed great young cores.
Honestly, if John Wall has a Tyreke Evans-like season, and the Wiz end up with a Sacto-like win total, are any of us going to be upset?
Huh?
Their second best player is Carl Landry or Jason Thompson. We’re gonna have Arenas/Wall/Blatche/McGee/Hinrich and more. We are in MUCH better shape than Sacramento last year.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I think the Wizards are a .500 team next season
Wizards fans are so punch drunk on failure they can’t see a good young roster right in front of their faces.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It's a good *young* roster
I think they’ll be good, but will go through a ton of growing pains.
But 17 million for a player who isn't taking us anywhere?
AND giving up flexibility next offseason, when we might actually want to start bringing in new talent? Both of those make this a less-than-appealing trade as reported. Granted, 2 years isn’t 3, but given the established going rate (see: pick 18), this is a sorry move.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Since when is an expiring contract not flexibility?
That’s what Hinrich’s contract will be next offseason.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
And you use it
to take on a BIIIIG contract when you are on the brink of winning a championship. Which they will not be in 2011-12.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions
See e.g.,
Ilgausuas (sp) for Jamison
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions
chi did not win and has been as bad as we have been since mj left them. so heinrich does not bring a winning spirit.
if we get a guy with a one year contract, we can do the same thing and get another first rounder next year.
so adding him costs us a lot of money and cap flexibility (we are no longer able to sign a max free agent (carmelo?) IF we wanted.
we get one first round draft choice and costs us (opportunity cost) one first round draft choice.
on its own, it is not that compelling AT ALL. but i am hoping he is shipped to ind for the 10th pick.
i am hoping that EG is thinking that with the 17th pick and some luck, he can work something out with someone to move down. and if not, then we did not come away empty handed. it’s not a horrible trade, just not good.
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Carmello is signing an extension
He’s already working on it. And Ted said no to big-name free agents.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Sumthin's gotta give
They cannot be happy with a backcourt rotation of Wall, Arenas, Hinrich, and Young…can they?
Why not?
Seems like a pretty good backcourt to me.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions
On the court its pretty good
Hinrich has shown he can defend a lot of different guys and adds 3 point shooting.
by forthepeople on Jun 24, 2010 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess it depends on how much Hinrich has left in the tank
4 years ago, he had the grit, the energy, and just enough speed to be really good. Now I’m not so sure…
huh?
Kirk Heinrich is 29 years old and hardly unable to play the 3rd guard role.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess...
I’m just not sure he’s AS persistent and pesky as he used to be.
i was never a big Hinrich fan
but i like the trade nonetheless
by John Park Williams on Jun 24, 2010 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Would be interesting...
Ideally, I’d like to see Gil play 2, Wall 1, interchangeable for clutch moments, then Young at 2 and Hinrich at 1 off bench. I guess in the perfect world Young could play 3. At least we can expect Hinrich to know how to be a role player for the Wiz, something they certainly need with the egos of Blatche, Arenas, and Wall.
i dont think they want young at all. havent heard a peep of him working out so far…the guy should have been there everyday since may 1.
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe this is....
a move to get the 10th pick…. Swap Hinrich plus 17 for Indy’s 10th.. We end up with 1, 10, 30 , 35…
Then why wouldn't the Bulls have done that?
More likely, move the 30th, 35th, and Heinrich to the Pacers for Dunleavy and the 10th. In the end, we take on 10 million for a year, lose the 30th/35th for the 10th/17th. Great deal if you ask me.
The Bulls would have to take on more salary to get Dunleavy. Both teams want to dump salary so somebody has to be a taker of salary, so there’s no way the Bulls could have done anything with Indiana directly.
by ThePGPhenomenon on Jun 24, 2010 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
No
Misunderstood what I was saying. Im saying the Pacers wont do the Heinrich+17 for the 10th or they would’ve done that with the Bulls. We should do the Dunleavy trade.
oohh ok I got you. What is Dunleavy’s contract though? How many years and $$$?
by ThePGPhenomenon on Jun 24, 2010 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions
1 year
at 9.5. A little more than Heinrichs this year, but it is expiring.
Yeah that would have been a much better deal. We needed another SF anyway. We don’t need another PG so yeah I agree with you.
by ThePGPhenomenon on Jun 24, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions
We can still do it.
I hope we can. I think it works for every team. The Pacers get what they want, a PG plus less costly draft picks. We get what we want, higher draft choices.
yes- v excited about this prospect. thanks for explaining it. and it really does make sense. shame we are enabling lebron to go to chi though
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
The Lebron thing doesn't bother me
He has to go somewhere
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I don’t know if it will still work. We would have to get rid of Hinrich first. Taking on his contract and Dunleavy at the same time is going to tie up the salary cap completely. I’d rather have just one of them, not both.
by ThePGPhenomenon on Jun 24, 2010 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions
We wouldn't have Heinrich's salary
They would… We would only have Dunleavy.
they’re not going to take Hinrich salary because they’re trying to cut salary. I know they need a point guard, but they could just keep the pick and draft one, and Dunleavy would be off the books next year, so what would they really gain? Hinrich would not be worth it for them.
by ThePGPhenomenon on Jun 24, 2010 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah
But rumor has it they wanted to move the 10th for a PG. There isn’t a PG of Heinrich’s caliber at 10. Plus they get the 30th and 35th pick for depth purposes. So they savethe difference between Heinirch/Dunleavy and the difference between the salary of the 10th pick and the salary of the 30th/35th pick. We could send 3 million in cash if that was a problem.
I don't think the #17 is valuable enough to take on Heinrich
I understand he is a decent player, I guess I’m just not looking for decent players at the moment. I’m looking for potential, and I don’t see much potential in #17 plus Heinrich. If it does turn out that this is part of a trade with Indiana, then I can see the benefit.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 4:19 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
why wouldnt they trade straight up between themselves then?
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 4:19 PM EDT reply actions
thats what I was wondering… but maybe the pacers wanted them to take a salary in return, suc a troy miller’s 10 mil…the bulls dont want to take that contract…We can absorb a one year hit of 10 mil so it works out for both teams, pacers get rid of an unwanted contract, get their guard and still get the 17th pick. Meanwhile we get into the top 10 and get a one year rental of troy murphy
Mike, I typically agree with your editorial decisions
But you gotta use this picture for a Hinrich article
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 4:20 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
i think ernie got scared when okc fired the first shot
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 4:21 PM EDT reply actions
I'm alright with this
Hinrich is a high-character vet. I’d prefer a 1-year contract, but don’t hate a 2-year.
I’d still like to see us make a play for Indiana’s or NO’s pick, but there’s a few hours left so we’ll have to see.
If this comes through and we pick up Childress, our line looks something like:
1. Wall, Hinrich
2. Arenas, Young, (pick?)
3. Childress, Thornton, Ross (pick?)
4. Blatche, (pick)
5. McGee, (pick)
So we take two big bodies and a SF/SG prospect with the 17, 30, and 35. I’m satisfied with that lineup. Lot of youth, some good-character/good-defense vets, and room to make other moves down the line…
That's a pretty solid roster
I think that’s a playoff team in the EC
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Not unless McGee makes serious strides
The EC is much improved, and a couple of teams are going to strike it big in the free agent sweepstakes.
I think it’s a fun-to-watch 28-game-winner.
that team would win the Rucker Park Tournament every year
by John Park Williams on Jun 24, 2010 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
that team would win the Rucker Park Tournament
ild take that team over the 09 starting 5 in a heartbeat
1. wall vs arenas
2. capt kirk vs miller
3. childress vs butler
4. blatche vs jamison
5. mcgee vs haywood
VOID!!!
McGee < Haywood
Blatche < Jamison
Childress ~ Butler
Wall >Arenas
Hinrich ~ Miller
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Agree except
Wall will NOT be > Arenas next year (unless you mean that Wall hopefully won’t be suspended for 75% of the season, in which case you are probably right).
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
we are talking about NEXT year
Wall’s PER likely won’t be more than 16 or 17 I would bet.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions
if wall was having arenas guard him 82 games a year his PER would be low triple digits… wall would be running circles around arenas
VOID!!!
and attacks my argument how exactly?
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions
i think it goes
arenas=arenas
wall>miller
lol
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions
That makes more sense.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions
WHAT?
I expect Wizards fans to know better than that. The Andray Blatche/ Nick Young/Shaun Livingston Wizards were 5-5 in their last 10 games. The Wizards are adding Wall/Arenas/Hinrich/Chidress and 3 draft picks to that roster.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Over the last 10 games?
Small sample size, my man, small sample size…
That's 12% of a season
which is small but not insignificant.
You know the Wizards were playing some really good Flip Saunders’ ball at the end of the season. With a VERY undermanned roster. A LOT of talent and athleticism being added.
by JonathanJoseph on Jun 24, 2010 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
agreed....need a solid center...
But i think we are already a better team than last year with JWall running the show
4 & 5 don't seem like the highlights of the low/mid draft
by MR on Jun 24, 2010 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, gotta see how it shakes out
- could be a wide range of good players who slip. I’ve seen mock drafts with Aldrich, Udoh, and Henry falling to that range. Personally, I’d like a SF/SG and two big bodies from those 3 picks (so each has a chance at playing time without facing a logjam) but it’ll depend on who’s available.
GREAT TRADE
This exactly what Leonsis was talking about: use cap room to bring in talent. I don’t care if the cap space occupies one year or two years: point is, we got a good pick out of it. PLUS, Kirk is a good, albeit overpaid, player. He will help us as a versatile backup to the 1 and 2 slots.
This is much better than flipping picks: EG is earning his money!!
by Tbonebullets on Jun 24, 2010 4:28 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
In a salary cap league
You cannot afford to overpay role players. If you are going to over pay, overpay for your stars. That 8.5 million next year could’ve bought Melo if he somehow gets to the market.
So what exactly would Peja be, champ? We’re paying for the pick, plus the added bonus that Kirk is better than trash.
by Tbonebullets on Jun 24, 2010 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah but with Peja
You only have to put up with him for one year. Now if we flip this for the tenth, all is forgiven. But as of now, this trade sucks.
Peja would be a one-year rental
Thus not affecting next season.
With Peja
You get the ability to take on another bad contract next year for another good pick.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Don’t assume the Peja deal is even being considered. If someone else pulls it off, then I will hate this trade. But if not, paying Kirk’s 2 year deal ain’t bad. Plus we still have more space to pull off deals.
by Tbonebullets on Jun 24, 2010 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
And we're losing flexibility
in 2011. Not worth a role player. If KH was a top 40 player then maybe.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Hollinger just tweeted that there maybe other considerations involved in this trade, so maybe there is more to this….
by ThePGPhenomenon on Jun 24, 2010 4:31 PM EDT reply actions
like the 30th pick in the draft
Mike Green in regular season- Norris Canadiate. Mike Green in Playoffs- Nowhere to be found
Wait, that wouldn't make him back off
He’s saying the Wiz suck for making this trade. If he was hearing that we were giving up even more, he wouldn’t be backing off.
Hope remains…
Grant Paulsen tweeted
That the Wiz may be giving up $3 mil in cash too.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
to give the bulls more cap room?
Mike Green in regular season- Norris Canadiate. Mike Green in Playoffs- Nowhere to be found
megaWTF
“Here, let us pay you money to help build a championship contender.”
That's not possible
Nobody could be that…wait, yeah he can. Seen it before.
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Arenas...
This may seem like a long shot……But does anyone think Arenas is involved? I just have a weird feeling
by Aquamaneastfish on Jun 24, 2010 4:33 PM EDT reply actions
i say he will be gone by the end of the draft.
Mike Green in regular season- Norris Canadiate. Mike Green in Playoffs- Nowhere to be found
i actually have the same feeling
Reminds me a lot of when the Blazers drafted Greg Oden, and everyone was trying to figure out if he could play alongside Zach Randolph. Randolph had just averaged 20 and 8 for the Blazers.
Kevin Pritchard decided it was better that Oden never even meet Randolph, and gave him to the Knicks.
by John Park Williams on Jun 24, 2010 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions
money?
Are the salaries close enough? and does the trade exception give us that option…..I could handle Hinrich being a 2-guard. It is an upgrade over Young.
by Aquamaneastfish on Jun 24, 2010 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Doubt it
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Draft Express tweeted that Elliot Williams has the chance to be the pick
No. Just no.
"Guess you guys aren't ready for that yet... but trust me, you're gonna love it." ~Marty McFly
3-way
This HAS to be the makings of a 3-way trade between us, CHI, and IND right?!? I know some of you have mentioned this above. Please tell me someone has seen a link in regards to something more along the lines of a 3-way rather than a straight up trade with CHI???
all the chatter
of CHI and IND trying to pull off a trade made absolutely no sense. I hope we’re the 3rd team that gets involved and end up with the 10th pick.
by geechy_suede on Jun 24, 2010 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions
hoopshype says:
Trade Rumor: Kirk Hinrich to Indiana. 17th pick included – Indiana targeting Gordon Hayward at 17. Not sure what Ind gives in deal. Twitter
I hope so — we’ll take on a load of Indy’s trash, as well as their pick!
by Tbonebullets on Jun 24, 2010 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions
That's an older rumor as far as I can tell
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions
This is just a possibility:
But I would be estatic if the Wiz pulled off this three way trade.
wiz recieve: 10th pick in 2010 draft
pacers recieve: Kirk Hinrich, Nick Young
bulls recieve: cash Considerations
Pacers would get 17th also....
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Pacers must be moving a player too
Otherwise they’re adding $10m in salary. And if they could do that, they wouldn’t need us.
Yeah this deal
is NOT happening.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions
How's that possible? Are the Pacers that far below the cap?
by MR on Jun 24, 2010 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, this either isn't happening
or else there’s another big piece to it.
Maybe (fingers crossed) we end up with the 10 and the 17, while absorbing a couple of Indiana’s one-year deals. We could take on both Dunleavy and Foster in exchange for Hinrich, for instance. That reduces their payroll (which they want), gives them a point guard (which they want), keeps us BOYDing (which we want) and reduces Chicago’s payroll (which they want).
…now that I write that all out, more likely that we send the 17 to IND, but take on two 1-year contracts in the process while nabbing the 10. I’d be fine with that.
both work for me…salivating at 10 and 17. this is such a good year to get aggressive it seems.
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/basketball/bulls/2429962,chicago-bulls-kirk-hinrich-trade-wizards-24.article
by rayallenisaballer on Jun 24, 2010 4:53 PM EDT reply actions
Whatever we do, I don't want to lose Arenas
And I know many disagree with me on this. :)
My swag was phenomenal.
Mike Jones
says the Wiz want Heinrich to mentor Wall. That leads me to believe he won’t be part of an Indiana deal.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 4:54 PM EDT reply actions
this is absolute horseshit
if thats the case
Not close...
Arenas will be assuming he is healthy…..:P
by Aquamaneastfish on Jun 24, 2010 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Plus he already has Rod Strickland...
Okay, maybe Hinrich’s not so bad afterall.
It's actually a league source
saying that the Wiz want a vet PG to mentor Wall and speculating that Heinrich would be a good fit, which makes me feel better.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions
kind of stressful
Wish we knew what was going on. You watching the draft anywhere in SF, Palace?
by BayAreaBullet on Jun 24, 2010 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I actually moved to ATL for a few weeks
then Costa Rica for a couple months, then back to DC. So, I’m not in SF anymore. I’m heading out for dinner tonight, so I won’t be able to keep track of everything that happens.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Sounds fun
I’m actually taking a red eye back to DC tonight but should be able to get most of the draft in before I go to the airport.
by BayAreaBullet on Jun 24, 2010 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions
I just realized that Hinrich
has been spelling his name wrong all these years.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Where is Rook?
We need all hands on deck to sort through this insanity.
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 4:57 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
This is madness
madness??? this is THE NBA DRAFT!!!!!!!!!!!!
by Ateneo on Jun 24, 2010 5:06 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Let's face it
Ernie did a bad deal to put the final nail in New York’s coffin.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:08 PM EDT reply actions
Let's not panic
The Bulls-Wiz reported trade makes no sense and contradicts what Ernie and Ted have been talking about (keeping their “powder” dry this off-season, building through young players, etc.). Plus, Hollinger says there is more to the deal, and the 18th pick was obtained yesterday for much less. Hopefully the Indiana part of this deal comes through. That deal would then make sense for everyone and would be consistent with what the Wizards front office has been saying all along. Let’s just chill for now.
The received the 17th pick.
That’s what they wanted and that’s what they said they were going to do.
The Shanahan era is going to bring the Redskins back to Glory! Great QB and an actual O-line.
9 million this season and 8 million next season
whereas OKC gave up 32nd pick and 2 million for this season (Cook) for the 18th.
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Looks like we still need a SF
RT @MikeJonesSports
Source says Wizards are not working on a deal with Josh Childress.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:17 PM EDT reply actions
the hits just keep on coming
i would have been much happier if we just stuck to our original picks
wait this is final? all the tweets i’m seeing says we’ve got hinrich already. i wonder what we gave up…
Ugh
Did the Trailblazers fire their GM for w/e reason. He can have a new DC home..
if pritchard is available- get him
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Since Miami and Chicago are rivals in the Lebron sweepstakes
Should we not have been able to leverage that into getting Miami to deal with us and not OKC?
If Pat Riley were smart, he would have given us his pick in exchange for cap space, just like Chicago did. Don’t assume it was EG’s fault that Miami didn’t make the right move!
by Tbonebullets on Jun 24, 2010 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Miami is still not done cutting cap space
Meaning we could have made them a better offer. We could have taken on Jones and Cook and that still would have been a better deal than the Hinrich deal. My hunch is that the Hinrich deal was completed because it was a deal that combined BOYD strategy with a desire to get a more talented bad contract in return. Hinrich > Cook and Jones but none of the three do anything for the Wizards goal of building a contender so its irrelevant. If we paid millions more to have a marginally more talented player come back as the BOYD, that is just plain stupid.
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions
We all need to take a breath...
We don’t know ANYTHING yet. I have no opinion on the Hinrich stuff, because I don’t KNOW anything; don’t know what’s to come, what other deals are in the works. Too soon to make any judgments.
apperantly michael lee has some additional details that hes working on now.
by rayallenisaballer on Jun 24, 2010 5:25 PM EDT reply actions
was the 30th pick involed in this trade. cuz if not. the redskins should take notice of how we handle this year’s draft. please ernie dont trade away any picks please
Mike Green in regular season- Norris Canadiate. Mike Green in Playoffs- Nowhere to be found
So...
We got Kirk Hinrich, who shoots 38% from 3, scores 11, 3.5 boards, 4.5 assists, 1 steal, can guard the oppositions primary wing AND the 17th pick in the draft for… basically nothing.
HORRIBLE.
You gotta remember that these fans have been abused for years…it’s like getting over Stockholm syndrome.
by Tbonebullets on Jun 24, 2010 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions
WE DONT KNOW WHAT WE ARE GIVING HE BULLS!!!!!
knowing EG its prob like gilbert,young #30 #35 and $20000000!!!
by rayallenisaballer on Jun 24, 2010 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Giving up cap space is not nothing
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
we
We didn’t give it up, we chose to use it on a specific player for a year. After that we can choose to keep him or trade him. Oh the horror.
How will trading him next year help us?
Do you think we will be able to trade Hinrich at $8 mil for draft picks? Not a chance, we would have to take more salary on. He is not a valuable trade chip until the 2012 deadline which means that we are in fact getting only one draft pick for two years of salary. The quality of player is largely irrelevant to a rebuilding team.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
rec
Cap space that allows Bulls to grab a second max level free agent in greatest free agent class of all time? Extremely valuable.
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
we lose the ability to sign a max free agent next year
we lose the ability to do take on another one year contract for another first round pick next year
he will help win games so our own picks next year will be lower
he will not contribute to a legit contending team. he will peak long after this team does
yeah- pretty horrible when there are other picks available to trade for.
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
rec'd
it’s nonsense to think this is any good.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe Ted
Is thinking further down the line than us fans
yeah he wants to build through the draft like he did with the caps while most fans want the free agent class of 2010
Mike Green in regular season- Norris Canadiate. Mike Green in Playoffs- Nowhere to be found
That is the thing
We don’t want to use the cap space today. We want to use that cap space to gain pieces. This trade only brings back a limited piece at a high cost. It also limits our ability to do that in the future.
except
That Hinrich can play and will be a trade chip himself as an expiring contract. We got something for now and something for later… AND A PLAYER!
Who will play where exactly?
I’d much rather have salary space next year.
he's a better fit at the 2 than Gilbert
because he can defend the position. There’s plenty of PT available.
the good news is last year’s analysis suggested he is the best complement to arenas!
by les boulez bomber on Jun 24, 2010 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions
oh EG
so earnest but always a year too slow on moves
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions
He won't be a trade chip until the trade deadline in 2012
Arenas will eventually be a trade chip – doesn’t make his contract a good one.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions
either way this deal is good
to me it would seem like a no brainer to flip this trade to indy for its 10th pick and dunleavy … they get their pt guard and save some money … we basically turned some of our cap space into a lottery pick … but if it turns out there is no other deal, than basically the wiz r taking an extra year of heinrich for a middle first round pick, is that so bad, unlike cook, heinrich does have skills and can contribute
Contributing is not very relevant
to a rebuilding franchise that has it’s eyes set on competing 3 or 4 years down the road.
by Palace of Good Play's Golden Toilet on Jun 24, 2010 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
We just hamstrung our franchise with a bad contract
For an ok pg. If we had gotten the 2nd overall pick and drafted Turner, then yeah, this trade is a good one. But we thankfully got Wall. Where will Heinrich play? Pacers hopefully. the 10th, foster and Dunleavy for Heinrich and the 30th.
kirk hinrich now averaging 4.5 ppg a game on the wiz in nba 2k10. john wall averaging 25.7 ppg with 10 assists
Mike Green in regular season- Norris Canadiate. Mike Green in Playoffs- Nowhere to be found
by Lancers25 on Jun 24, 2010 5:32 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Great trade
Dont get you guys not wanting to give away Gilbert………too small to play the 2 and on top of that he is absolutely the worst defender I have ever seen in the nba. Hinrich will at least give us defense and an expiring contract in 2 years. Gilbert has done nothing for us but just get into the first round and out.
does hinrich have a team option after 1 year.or is it a straight 2 year deal then he is off the books
Mike Green in regular season- Norris Canadiate. Mike Green in Playoffs- Nowhere to be found
wow this is getting better every min.....not
by rayallenisaballer on Jun 24, 2010 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions
It's an official way of saying we're giving up nothing
"Guess you guys aren't ready for that yet... but trust me, you're gonna love it." ~Marty McFly
What a tragedy
having to give up a future 2nd rounder like that. Seriously, pal, get a grip and quit reacting to every bit of news like it’s a catastrophe.
Congratulations Stanicek!
Announced this afternoon as the new moderator of BF. Way to go pal
by morethesamewiz on Jun 24, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Picks projected around #17
Draft Express’s 16-20:
Gordon Hayward
Damion James
Avery Bradley
Eric Bledsoe
James Anderson
Several 2s and 3s there we could definitely use…I’d like Anderson, personally.
Any chance everybody can wait until to tomorrow or so to start screaming about the sky falling?
I have never been an EG supporter, but seriously, how about everybody just relax and see where the cards fall before we lynch him (or applaud him for that matter)?
no, there is no chance of that
It’s happy hour and we’re internet-based fans. Have pitchfork, will travel.
by sierradave on Jun 24, 2010 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Seriously
You can’t expect patience from us – especially when we’re still stinging from last year’s absolute debacle of a draft and I’m sporting a mild buzz
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Mike is in NY
covering things live. Jake and I will be around tonight to start new threads.
The artist formerly known as ledellforlife.
I think we need a new one
I’m going to have a seizure if I have to keep reading posts defending the Hinrich deal (or about the Hinrich “deal” at all, given that we know NOTHING about the details).
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Now now
I’m not pleased about it either. For many reasons.
But the draft thread is now up. Everyone please leave your knives and guns at home.
The artist formerly known as ledellforlife.
setting the pitchfork and torch down
for now…. :p
Getting buckets since 2003.
by Icantfeelmyface on Jun 24, 2010 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Guys we still have a roster to fill out
And do we really want some do leaguers playing with john wall. you have to surround him with at least some to talent
by ccrun1800 on Jun 24, 2010 5:43 PM EDT via mobile reply actions