Shaun Livingston on the Wizards: "We're still so far from being a playoff-caliber team"
At this point, the games themselves really aren't that interesting. Last night was no exception. The Wizards hung around for three quarters against a very good team, but then Jamal Crawford caught fire and the Hawks pulled away to get the win. It was pretty ho-hum, all things considered.
So really, we're left with digging for storylines that will affect how the Wizards act this summer. One such storyline, of course, is the fate of Shaun Livingston. Obviously, the whole Livingston angle is a huge, multi-layered story in and of itself, one that I'm working on telling as we speak. But perhaps the scariest layer of that story from our perspective is that it may continue in another city next year.
So from that perspective, it was really interesting to talk to Livingston last night after the game.
First, let's set the scene. Normally, Livingston is among the earliest Wizards to emerge to talk to the media, but tonight, he was nowhere to be found. As it turned out, he was taking an extended soak in the whirlpool as a way to help his body recover from playing over 40 minutes in back-to-back nights. A number of media folk waited around until finally a Wizards PR guy told everyone that Livingston was "gonna be a while." Everyone left except me and a Comcast SportsNet crew, because neither of us had deadlines to worry about. Finally, Livingston emerged, dragging his clearly sore body from the training room to his locker. He saw us glancing at him and immediately said, in a friendly way, "You guys ready? Let's get this over with."
The questions veered from the game itself ("Be careful what you ask for," he said, smiling, when asked about all the minutes he was playing) to larger topics that I wanted to cover, like his injury recovery, his jumper, etc. But eventually, the topic of this summer came up, and Livingston definitely seemed like he was positioning himself in a potential contract negotiation.
"[My time here has been] beneficial, productive, and it's been a great opportunity for me. I'm thankful for that and I'm trying to make the most of it. [But] we'll see [about next season]. It's a business. You got to see what happens. I was on the outside looking in, now I'm on the inside and I hope to stay that way."
"Like I said, it's a business," he said a little later. "At the end of the day, [the Wizards] gave me a chance because they felt I could help the team, and it was an opportunity for me, so at the end of the day, it's a win win. Hopefully things turn out for the better for both sides."
Nothing too crazy, though from experience, I know that, whenever you're trying to make a point in a non-combative way, you start with positive reinforcement before going into what you really want to get across.
Eventually, trying to find a good way to end the interview, I asked him about what type of growth he's seen from some of the other young guys on the team during his time here. His answer surprised me a bit.
"It's coming along, [but] we're still so far, so far from being a playoff-caliber team," he said. "I've been around winning basketball and have seen what it takes, and there's still that progression. You want to see glimpses of it if you're the coach, the organization or the players. Like I said, it's all about getting better, evaluating players, and guys stepping up."
Have you seen those glimpses, Shaun?
"I have, I have. I feel like, first of all, guys have to want to win, and that's where it starts. Then, it's making sacrifices and dedicating yourself. The little things - loose balls, making stops, all those things."
That the Wizards are still far away from being a playoff-caliber team is pretty damn obvious. So obvious that it's odd to hear someone saying it so explicitly. Livingston certainly didn't need to sell me on that point, and I'm pretty sure it's a little late in the season to be selling that point to his teammates.
But every word a non-Gilbert Arenas athlete says has a purpose, so what was Shaun's purpose? Perhaps he's trying to send a message to the organization, as if to say, "I want to be with an organization that's dedicated to winning, and I need to know this organization is fully committed to all the steps you need to take to win." This isn't to say that Livingston definitely doesn't want to be a part of that road. I don't know that, and neither does anyone. But it could be a way of Livingston throwing a bargaining chip into this summer's free agency negotiations.
Here's hoping the "I have, I have" portion of his answer was coming straight from the heart and not merely a way to avoid the question, because Livingston leaving would eradicate possibly the only good thing that's happened to this team all season.
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Agree whole-heartedly
Yet again.
I’d sooner see Livingston with Arenas’ contract than Arenas. That’s how much better the other players are on the floor with him at point.
That is going a little too far
Arenas had four or five great seasons. Shaun’s had three good weeks.
You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.
Basketball is a business
And it’s what have you done for me lately. What has Arenas done for this team lately? Ummm.
How about Livingston during the past 8 meaningless tank games? 4 – 4. A better record than point guard Arenas has managed during any stretch since his first knee injury. If anything’s a stretch, it’s Arenas’ contract.
well by that standard...
he was also part of a 16 game losing streak, where he got significant minutes the last 8 or so of those games. AND there was a stretch this year where the Wizards won 4 out of 5 with Gil at the helm. Just sayin’
by SkinsWizStangs on Apr 12, 2010 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
You're just sayin'
That there’s full equivalency between the two players at present. Which is why I said I’d sooner have Livingston. Look at the teammates he’s made look better compared to those that Arenas made look worse.
Who did Arenas make look worse?
Was it DeShawn Stevenson, who went from being a dude on the scrap heap to being a 50% scorer and a capable starting two guard?
Was it Caron Butler, who went from being a guy nobody wanted to an all-star while playing with Arenas?
Was it Antawn Jamison, who posted his best shooting numbers of his career while he was here?
Was it Jared Jeffries, who went from being a key cog in DC to a completely worthless player in New York?
Was it Larry Hughes, who was an all-star with Arenas and soon evolved into “Hey Larry Hughes, Please Stop Taking So Many Shots” once he left?
The whole “Arenas made his teammates worse” angle is a cliche that has pretty much no basis in reality. Let’s not rewrite history here.
You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.
Yep
Some people just can’t seem to get over the fact that Arenas is a point guard and an elite scorer (when he is completely healthy). It goes against their universe of thinking. A point guard cannot possibly help a team if he is their primary scoring option, or so they think. We are going to have to answer against this line of thinking for as long as Gilbert remains on this team.
"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier
"...don't ever think it can't get any worse, because it can. There's no question, it can." -- Flip Saunders unintentionally coining the new Washington Wizards motto
No, You'll be going up against Gilbert
No matter how hopeful you are, he’ll find some new way to break your heart next season. You want to put money on his completing the season as an “elite” scorer?
And he is not and has never been a point guard. He is a combo guard.
How quickly you forget--
That these guys all did just as well—if not better—when Antonio Daniels and even Roger Mason Jr were playing the point. As for Hughes, there’s still some confusion about their roles. Wasn’t he initially the point guard for Cleveland?
In any case, as I said before, the real measure is “what have you done for me lately?” By that measure Livingston is at least as valuable as arenas. And minus the baggage.
When you adamantly persue things like this
you undermine your own credibility.
cuppetcj is right. At least until Livingston can be a real asset for the majority of a season.
Livingston’s last 20 games points (going backwards):
15
25
7
21
16
12
18
2
14
6
4
9
8
6
4
6
18
3
2
4
6
A good trend, but a bit of a small sample.
I wonder if Livingston would be enticed to stay
If we got Evan Turner? Put’s us alot closer to playoff contention.
Wall and he is as good as gone. I want Turner.
Spoken like a man about to be a free agent.
Don’t really see anything to get worked up over…thanks for waiting around to talk to him PM. Just like Mike Miller, Amare Stoudemire, or Chris Bosh talking about their upcoming FA. Just good business sense not to commit, and to remind the establishment that he’s going to be headhunted, and wants to be part of a committed organization, like any other professional.
We're from the city with the highest murder rate in the country. Why WOULDN'T they call us the Bullets?
by Bullet Nation in Exile on Apr 11, 2010 11:26 PM EDT reply actions
Like all of us
I’m really curious to see what kind of market is out there for Shaun this summer. This is a fairly unique situation given his injury history combined with the CBA issue, a potential lockout looming, and the macro economic conditions.
Obviously we’d all like to bring him back at a reasonable contract, but what is reasonable I wonder?
I would really like to see them resign Livingston
But I’m pretty sure it’s not gonna happen
yeah i'm beginning to get that sense too
i really like the way he plays. but the word is out, the sample size of good games is becoming significant. there will be competition, and what do the wiz have to offer over someone else?
"how ironic - you came here with a mouse in a bottle, now YOU are the mouse in the bottle" - B.M. Smith
by little stevie colter on Apr 12, 2010 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Whoa?
I agree that the Wiz will have competition for SL’s services and that his comments are a little concerning, but…
What do the Wiz have to offer? For starters, cap space and a need for a PG. That alone takes out 2/3 of the teams in the NBA.
Then you’ve got 2 young, emerging studs as big men, Gilbert Arenas, a high lottery pick coming in and even more cap space? How about one of the best coaches in the NBA for PGs?
The Wiz will have plenty to offer.
by JonathanJoseph on Apr 12, 2010 4:42 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree... but
1. The Wizards are luckless
2. Gilbert has not yet said he is willing to play off the ball (assuming, as most of us seem to do that Gilbert will be a Wizard next season).
As you say, Mike, Shaun Livingston is the best story on the Wizards this sorry season.
I really hope we can find the right rationale and the right contract to keep him on board.
yes exactly -
the fact the livingston and gilbert play the same position is of concern. i think it could work, and is very interesting, but from livingston’s perspective, it may make other places attractive.
"how ironic - you came here with a mouse in a bottle, now YOU are the mouse in the bottle" - B.M. Smith
by little stevie colter on Apr 12, 2010 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Second-best story
Shaun Livingston is the best story on the Wizards this sorry season
I’d have to go with Blatche. Livingston’s progress has been nice, but we just promoted an all-star from our bench (yep, I’m convinced), and he even plays defense. Doesn’t that win?
Livingston makes it easier....
…to dump Arenas. The young guys are improving. The formula:
1) playing time
2) confidence of the coach (e.g., no yanking and screaming after every little mistake)
3) no Arenas to set a bad goofball example and defecate in shoes, etc.
They’ll need to trade up in the draft depending on the draws.
I'm Curious
I want to get everybody’s thoughts on this. Does Livingston’s desire to play for a good organization committed to winning trump his assumed desire for more playing time? I mean, would he be willing to be the backup PG on a good time as opposed to the starting PG on a not-so-good team? Which factor do you think is greater?
We may be behind the 8-ball in negotiations either way, because if we resign him he would likely not start and we would likely not be an elite team. However, he would probably get more playing time for us than he would for a better team with a more established PG.
"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier
"...don't ever think it can't get any worse, because it can. There's no question, it can." -- Flip Saunders unintentionally coining the new Washington Wizards motto
Economic security will play a big role in his decision, too, I think
If the Wizards draft well and offer Livingston a multi-year contract, I have to think he would be sorely tempted to stay with the team.
The fact that a player of his known gifts could sit on the shelf for so long after OKC cut him and before the Wizards signed him in desperation suggests that GMs around the league are not convinced that his knee can stand up to the rigors of a full NBA campaign. Despite what he has done for the Wizards in recent weeks, I am pretty sure that now, on the eve of a new CBA bargaining round, no GM is going to be willing to go all that far out on a limb.
I am not saying that the Wizards should offer him the store, but if the team could give Stevenson a $3.5 three year deal, they should be able to make Stevenson an offer in that general ballpark .
He may already be financially secure
He made enough in the past that if he was smart with it, he shouldn’t have to worry about ever being broke. If I were in that situation, I’d be focusing on what was best for my career. What I think is best for his career is a multi-year contract with a team that he could win a starting job on. If I’m him and I’m looking at Arenas and his contract, I’d be hoping a better situation presented itself.
have to resign Livingston
I like the way he’s playing as a starter, but he’ll play good off the bench as well. The goal of this rebuilding process was a team that will compete for a championship. Livingston and Young as our guards won us some games and we have this idea that if they play together next year as starters that they’ll be great. Our 4 pieces of Livingston, Young, Blatche, and McGee are promising, but we don’t have a franchise player yet. Arenas isn’t it and Blatche isn’t going to be the main piece of a championship team. Both our solid players that could help get there, but not a Lebron, Kobe, Dwayne, Shaq, Duncan, Hakeem worthy.
We are gonna have to draft well and rebuild slow and smart.
I completely agree
I would love to see mgmt rebuild the right way instead of constantly trying to plug the holes on a sinking ship. This has been an issue for the past 30 years. The organization and team need to be rebuilt from the ground up. I’m sure (hoping at the least) Leonsis knows this and will take this approach going forward.
by TheRealBigMike on Apr 12, 2010 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I say we bring him back...
excellent back up to BDud-dy!…We miss him!
Roger Sterling: To my knees, Don. They're bringing to my knees!"
Clips fan here by the way!
Roger Sterling: To my knees, Don. They're bringing to my knees!"
by Lawler's Law on Apr 12, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
hell i'd take him over baron after this year.
"how ironic - you came here with a mouse in a bottle, now YOU are the mouse in the bottle" - B.M. Smith
by little stevie colter on Apr 12, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Clipper fan here
It is really amazing to watch Livingston’s game blossom into what we thought it would be before the catastrophic injury. Although we hoped he would be playing like this for the clippers especially after we patiently waited for him after the injury, but I digress. It would be awesome if ever came back and play for the clippers but I don’t think we offer him the opportunity in terms of play time that he would like.
LeBron or Bust !!!!

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