The most logical FA target for 10-11
by dt3 on Mar 11, 2010 5:40 PM EST
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I was responding to another BFer in my potential draft pick thread when I started to notice just how young our locker room could potentially be next year. This got me thinking on who we could possibly bring in to replace some of the character we lost when we traded Jamison away. I am copy/pasting alot of this fan post directly from that response so forgive me if you are reading it again.
I think if this team is ever going to succeed they need to get a new team mentality in place and part of that team mentality has to be an increased defensive philosophy.
the team already has a handful of young, impressionable/immature players (Young, Blatche, McGee, yould have to think an 18-20 yr old draft pick) that 1) have the potential to be good/great 2) have alot of growing up to do if they ever want to reach their potential. How are these players going to react when its obvious that the highest paid player (by 400%), longest nba tenured (by 4 years) player isnt giving it his all on the defensive end (i know these numbers could change by the start of next season but its what we are looking at now).
We’ve seen 3 different coaches fail in improving the defense of this squad, and that was with AJ + CB being veteran voices in the locker room. While I think his individual defense still leaves a little to be desired I think Derek Fisher is one of the few NBA players who could walk into this locker room and instantly command the attention/respect of this team and actually get through to them (plus do it at a reasonable price).
As the president of the NBA players association he might also be interested in trying to bring Gilbert under his wing and mentor him. Having seen (IMO) the best player in the league mature (and go through his own personal issues) he might have some insight in helping Gil get back on the right track. I also wouldnt be surprised to find out he has political aspirations for after his playing days are over, being in washington for a year or two could definitely help him meet the type of people that could get the ball rolling towards that.
The fact that he would play a position that is currently one of our weakest (backup PG) only makes the fit that much better. Of course it might be hard to commit a player that is so used to winning to "take a step back" in Washington but I really would like the move. What do you guys think? Any other potential vets we could bring in (again, without breaking the bank) to add some locker room presence??
This represents the view of the user who wrote the FanPost, and not the entire Bullets Forever community. We're a place of many opinions, not just one.
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What on earth makes you think
DFish would leave LA period?
And second, what makes you think he would leave LA for the Wizards?
meh
Didn’t we already see how quickly a 10-year veteran Point Guard could go from pretty OK, to pretty awful in one year? (see Antonio Daniels)….
Well, Fisher is in his 13th year……..
Bullets Forever - where "Dagger ! " happens......
When has Fisher ever been good really?
Yeah he’s made a couple of big shots and his three point shooting is great but he’s never been a great defender or anything. At some point, being a “good locker room guy” gets over valued and we just really don’t need him wasting cap space or a roster spot next year.
And if anything with his hectoring and haranging (sp?)
and his encouragement of the coaches to do the same AJ hindered the development of McGee, Blatche and Young. Yes there impressionable and immature, but playing is one of the ways you can solve that. What these young men need is a coach that believes in them and will tell them there mistakes, put an arm around their shoulder when they need it and a foot in the rear end when they need it.
"I say he does have to shoot me now! So shoot me now!" --- Daffy Duck
by George Templeton on Mar 16, 2010 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Can't everything that was said about Fisher be said about Sam Cassell?
by pantslessyoda1 on Mar 11, 2010 11:00 PM EST reply actions
Well yeah, except
Cassell has a suit on, not warmups. That’s a world of difference.
So you say we need an increased defensive philosophy and then advocate a dude who can no longer defend anyone?
You lost me.
by BayAreaBullet on Mar 12, 2010 1:19 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I dont expect Fish to be the one teaching them the D… I expect him to be one getting in their ass when they dont listen to the one teaching them the D
VOID!!!
All grown up!!!
These are all grown men. Who cares if someone else is yelling at them. And im sure it just annoys them to have someone else “in their ass”. I dont think that Fisher being “in their ass” will help them become better on defense. At this point they have to do things themselves. Thats what grown-ups do.
Described
I think you described Lindsey Hunter, not Fish. coach on the floor who sets a tone through preparation, energy and hustle.
bring in fisher to coach maybe
hell why not just turn the whole coaching staff over to recently retired point guards… cassell at head coach, fisher, lindsey hunter and eddie house as assistants, and allen iverson as strength and conditioning coach… o and avery johnson at GM
hey if they would have done the right thing and hired avery johnson to begin with we wouldnt even be in this situation
VOID!!!
No thank you.
He was so much of a disciplinarian that his players quit on him.
"Guess you guys aren't ready for that yet... but trust me, you're gonna love it." ~Marty McFly
I think the last 2 years has shown if you want a guy to mentor the kiddies the player needs to be relevant ON the court
Everyone was so happy about bringing Oberto in for his “Championship Experience” but we already had one bench warmer with a ring and it’s not like Mike James was bringing much to the table. The young guys don’t listen to anyone who doesn’t play.
great idea
im not being sarcastic. really….
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I take that back. What you’re thinking of is a coach. Sam Cassell is doing what you want Fisher to do. Fisher is a valuable starter because he understands his role and is a clutch shooter. How many clutch shots will he be taking for a team that might not even go to the playoffs?
Err, from a Lakers fan's perspective, you guys don't want Fisher
Now, next year, or ever. He’s arguably the worst starting point guard in the league, has declined on the defensive end to the point that he can’t cover any point guard, fast or not, and his shooting has declined enormously. Plus, his “veteran leadership” is usually seen in some pretty poor decision-making on the offensive end, usually involving really bad shots early in the shot clock. Kupchak overpaid for him before the ‘07-’08 season because our other option was Smush Parker, and well, you can’t go anywhere but up from there.
At this juncture, Washington simply needs an infusion of more talent (which is Wall, Turner, Cousins, Favors, in that order) and probably following the OKC model of sitting on your cap space, waiting for good deals, and slowly developing your existing talent.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
I may have missed the mark on the actual target but people got so wrapped up in bashing DFish that they missed the whole point… that this team needs to bring in some type… ANY type of veteran leadership (especially if the pooping bandit aka agent deuce aka the $906,000 man aka Gilbert Arenas returns to the locker room).
I understand Fisher would not be as effective as someone in the regular playing rotation but until someone finds another player I still think he should be brought in as a 3rd PG. F#@*, I wouldnt be against signing Karl Malone to be the 12th guy on the bench slash official Gilbert head slapper when he starts actin up in practice. Then again maybe Andray “Do I look like I care about my f&#$ing knee?” Blatche can convince Gilbert to stop defecating on/in his personal property long enough to gain some respect in the locker room… i doubt it though.
At this juncture, Washington simply needs an infusion of more talent (which is Wall, Turner, Cousins, Favors, in that order)
ahhh… the cruel mistress that is the curse of les boulez… a draft where we desperately need one of the top 4 players and we are currently slotted 5th (well before 1-3 teams inevitably leap frogs us in that sham they call the lottery). To make matters worse if one of those 4 were to drop to us it would have to be cousins or favors who both play the same position as our best young player (Blatche).
and probably following the OKC model of sitting on your cap space, waiting for good deals, and slowly developing your existing talent.
Ehhh… thats what they arguably should have done in the summer of 08 rather than resigning an injured headcase to a max 95% of a max deal and resigning his buddy Antawn “aka mr defensive liability aka the raffy palmeiro of basketball” Jamison to a $50M dollar deal. This is a team that, before their short run of success with Gil, made the playoffs once in 16 years. They are so afraid of falling back into the rut of perpetual mediocrity that they are going to aim for the quick fix, bandaid and scotch tape treatment, keeping their fingers crossed for a 6th-8th playoff seed and inebbbitable first round exit.
I find it so amusing that at the beginning of the season everyone, even the wizards fans, was constantly throwing around the definition of insanity line about the big 3 (arenas, jamison, butler) being thrown out there one last time and expecting different results. But here we are 6 months later and everyone is thinking that we can reintroduce gilbert to an even younger, even more impressionable locker room and expect completely different results out of him.
VOID!!!
This is a team that, before their short run of success with Gil, made the playoffs once in 16 years. They are so afraid of falling back into the rut of perpetual mediocrity that they are going to aim for the quick fix, bandaid and scotch tape treatment, keeping their fingers crossed for a 6th-8th playoff seed and inebbbitable first round exit.
Perpetual mediocrity? That’s a good definition of the big 3 years… The previous 2.5 decades were ‘the rut of perpetual suckitude’. I’ll pass, and I hope the wiz do too.
I’m sorry but I think it may be you who is thinking in the short term (as in quickest way to championship contention). At the very least, a perennial playoff team is building a winning tradition (and that’s necessary to have any chance at attracting quality players to come here in free agency and certain trades…). There is no chance the Wizards will be in championship contention in the next decade. Would you rather they keep sucking and waiting to get lucky in the draft? I’ll take perennial playoffs over that ten times out of ten.
As of right now, Portland, OKC and Atlanta have not won a championship. They haven’t even sniffed one. So how valid is that model? Really? Looks to me like they’ve all built (through the draft) perennial playoff contenders with no real shot at a championship. And that’s the reality, that the wiz can make the right personnel moves and be exactly that next year or the following year. Why wait for luck to strike?
Err, this statement is completely wrong
As of right now, Portland, OKC and Atlanta have not won a championship. They haven’t even sniffed one. So how valid is that model? Really? Looks to me like they’ve all built (through the draft) perennial playoff contenders with no real shot at a championship. And that’s the reality, that the wiz can make the right personnel moves and be exactly that next year or the following year. Why wait for luck to strike?
The core of those three teams is all very young, especially for OKC. Portland was a .500 team two seasons ago. OKC was horrible last year. Atlanta is just starting to put all the talent together (although with Johnson leaving, that might be up in the air). You don’t go from mediocrity or pure crap to deep playoff runs in the space of two or three years, especially in the case of Portland or OKC, which honestly right now are better than Washington has been at any point in the past decade and can get far better.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
I don't see how your point invalidates mine.
Yes you do have a point. You are correct in that you don’t go from bottom feeding to deep playoff runs in the space of a few years. In fact, that is exactly my point.
My point is this: name a team that built in the manner that these three teams have and then won a championship? They (OKC, Portland, and ATL) are just the most recent teams to try it. My point is that because these teams didn’t have a winning tradition in place, they couldn’t acquire the player or two that may have put them into championship contention.
My point is that until you are in a position to acquire that key FA or make that key trade, you will perpetually be a playoff contender at best (so why wait for a bunch of draft picks to mature (especially when the ceiling has been established) when you can get there much faster using a combination of player acquisition methods???).
How do you get in a position to make those key non-draft acquisitions? By creating a winning tradition. How do you do that? Posting winning records over a long period and making some noise in the playoffs every now and then helps…
I’ll tell you what process has been validated: Create an environment where winning is expected, and make some key draft picks, trades, and free agent acquisitions (sounds a lot like the last 10 champs, and the contending teams that didn’t win it all, to me…). At the base of all that is having a winning tradition. And you create that by winning.
So I’ll pass on suckitude in any form. But that’s just me… the advantage you gain in high draft picks also establishes a firm disadvantage in the other player acquisition methods.
the advantage you gain in high draft picks also establishes a firm disadvantage in the other player acquisition methods.
Here is where you lost me…. completely. A team with a core of high draft picks is, in turn, a team where your core players are making 3-5 million a year. Liked I mentioned in another (horribly received) thread this team could put together a core of blatche, mcgee, and turner/wall and be paying the 3 of them less than they would pay for a joe johnson/rudy gay type free agent.
Now look at it the other way… if we go about rebuilding through free agency we not only kill all of our cap space we also handcuff ourselves into the nba limbo of never being good enough to be a contender, never being bad enough to win the lottery.
VOID!!!
...that's just stupid
As is your conception of a so-called “winning tradition,” which is moronic. The starting point for any championship team is simply the accumulation of talent, which means you suck for a time until you get enough assets (and a GM competent and lucky enough to properly use them). Not sucking for a long period of time means you’re trapped in the perpetual “I’m good enough to make the seventh or eighth seed in the playoffs but suck too much to move past that” at some point which then requires you to either pull a miracle trade or proceed to suck enough to get a high enough draft pick, which basically was what Washington was in the past few years.
I’ll tell you what process has been validated: Create an environment where winning is expected, and make some key draft picks, trades, and free agent acquisitions (sounds a lot like the last 10 champs, and the contending teams that didn’t win it all, to me…). At the base of all that is having a winning tradition. And you create that by winning.
In any case, I fail to see how a winning tradition is essential to any of that whatsoever. Key draft picks require sucking for a time, trades require a competent GM, which has nothing whatsoever to do with a winning tradition, and free agent acquisitions, again, require a competent GM who was smart enough to have enough cap space and have enough assets to still have a functioning team.
Plus, your entire argument ignores the fact that the “win the championship” part is a complete crapshoot that depends on luck more than anything, as well as ignoring the fact that all three teams you’ve mentioned can’t be validated until they’ve run through with their current core, which was my point. Atlanta could win the title this year for all we know. It depends solely on matchups and luck. Charlotte knocking off Cleveland in the first round, Atlanta squeaking past Orlando, annihilating Boston in the ECF, and then beating whatever team that comes out West is a legitimate possibility. New York could sign LeBron and Bosh and a few veteran role players and win a championship where there hasn’t been a “winning tradition” for the past decade.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
Thanks Ben
I’ll address your points. But please have some class. No matter how ridiculous you think my thoughts are, just remember that I have a right to them, as you do yours… Oh, and use the reply button.
Key draft picks don’t necessarily mean to high draft picks. Ask Phoenix if Steve Nash is a key draft pick. Not much to do with winning tradition, except for the fact that I believe players develop better on winners.
Key trades. Losers usually make trades for monetary purposes. When they don’t, they tend to get leftover or afterthought players, who typically aren’t anywhere near enough to take them over the top. The only teams that make trades for difference maker players are the teams that expect to contend for championships. Teams with winning traditions. Or in the case of Cleveland/Orlando, teams that are capitalizing on draft-day luck and forging a roster around a megastar.
Key free agent acquisitions. The players than can and do help teams win championships don’t sign with teams that don’t have a chance to win a championship. Unless they’re looking for their first or second big contract. This fact is well out of the control of any front office stiff, and well known. I’m surprised you didn’t know that…
Winning the championship is luck? Not in the NBA. If it was luck, then you wouldn’t have two teams claiming over half of the championships to date (and the top five championship winners claiming nearly 75% of the championships). Winning the NBA championship is about finding a superstar, and pouring as much money and/or cheap talent as possible into the supporting cast (with 2004 Detroit being the exception). In that regard OKC has a shot. Portland and Atlanta, probably not. Now, name me a team that built in the ATL/OKC/POR fashion and won a championship. The ceiling has been established. They will need to add players via other means besides the draft.
Not sucking for a long time means you’re winning some games. That’s preferable to me. You’re entitled to your opinion. Not winning for a long time does not guarantee talent accumulation. It guarantees nothing. Except losses…
Key draft picks don’t necessarily mean to high draft picks. Ask Phoenix if Steve Nash is a key draft pick. Not much to do with winning tradition, except for the fact that I believe players develop better on winners.
steve nash was a free agent signing that developed in Dallas
except for the fact that I believe players develop better on winners.
horrible logic for 2 reasons… 1) winning teams are allowed to take bigger risks on some players that lower teams might not be able to wait/gamble on (ie spurs parker/ginobli) 2) winning teams are allowed to slowly work young players in a rotation and/or put them in situations where they are much more likely to succeed as opposed to struggling teams that have to put the weight of the world on their shoulders (ie spurs dejaun blair)
VOID!!!
Now, name me a team that built in the ATL/OKC/POR fashion and won a championship.
the chicago bulls
your logic has so many holes in it i dont even know where to begin… you say you dont want to build through the draft but then say that big name free agents wont sign with a team like us. Do you plan to establish this culture of winning with players only looking for that first/last big contract??
You miss on a draft pick you are out $5-10M and you try again next year, you miss on a free agent and you are out $50-100M and probably wont get another chance til you can get that mistake off your books 4-5 years down the road.
VOID!!!
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