Competition Discussion: Atlanta Hawks
The season is still a ways away, but most of the rosters are set, barring the requisite Michael Jordan comeback rumor (just kidding, but only a little). We have an idea where our team stands, but we can't really know unless we discuss everyone else. In that spirit, I'm going to throw up a "competition discussion" thread for each of the other 29 teams over the next couple months or so. We'll go in alphabetical order from A to Z. Today's team: Atlanta. Jump to the comments to discuss the Hawks and make a prediction on their record.
Last year's record: 47-35 (Pythagorean record: 46-36)
Playoffs: beat Miami 4-3 in first round, lost to Cleveland 4-0 in second round
Offensive Rating: 109.3 (10th)
Defensive Rating: 107.6 (11th)
Pace: 89.6 possessions/game (24th)
In: Jamal Crawford, Joe Smith, Jeff Teague
Out: Flip Murray, Acie Law, Speedy Claxton's Expiring Contract
Projected starting lineup: Mike Bibby, Joe Johnson, Marvin Williams, Josh Smith, Al Horford
Key themes:
- How much more can this team actually improve?
- Will Mike Woodson open up the offense more to get more people involved?
- Can Josh Smith truly channel his immense athleticism into smart on-court play?
- Was bringing back Mike Bibby the right move?
- What happens to Joe Johnson after the season?
- Can Jamal Crawford match the output we saw from Flip Murray last year?
- What type of development are we going to see from the three young forwards (Smith, Marvin Williams, Al Horford?
- Can Joe Smith be a veteran leader to help teach this team how to take the next step?
It's often said that it's much easier to go from 25 wins to 45 wins than it is to go from 45 wins to 55 wins. The Hawks are going to be a good test for that theory this year. They've improved slowly and surely over the years (their win totals since 2005: 13, 26, 30, 37, 47) and are hoping to improve again through internal growth. While the rest of the East made big moves, the Hawks did small things, trading a couple out-of-rotation guys for Jamal Crawford, drafting raw rookie point guard Jeff Teague and signing veteran big man Joe Smith.
All in all, it's hard to see how Atlanta got worse. Crawford is normally an improvement over Flip Murray, though Murray was so good relative to the rest of his career last year that he actually approached normal Crawford production. Teague replaces Acie Law as the young point guard du jour, though it's an open question how good Teague actually is and how much coach Mike Woodson plans on using him. The only major upgrade seemingly is Joe Smith, who adds a lot more as the fourth big man on the team than Solomon Jones.
And yet, it's hard to see how Atlanta got better. Their frontcourt of Josh Smith, Marvin Williams and Al Horford remains young, but the backcourt of Joe Johnson and Mike Bibby is pretty established. It's possible Williams, Smith and Horford each improve their games substantially, but that would be fairly shocking at this point. It would require Smith developing a brain and playing to his strengths, which he hasn't shown he can do. It'd require Horford getting more touches in the post, which Woodson hasn't shown he'll allow. It'd require Williams developing some real one-on-one chops, which probably won't happen because he hasn't yet and because Woodson's guard-oriented offense won't allow it.
In short, they're stuck, and the East isn't getting any worse. Last year, the Hawks raced off to a hot start and then plateaued. In the meantime, Philadelphia struggled to adjust to Elton Brand, the Raptors fell off, Wizards suffered all sorts of injuries and Detroit fell off the face of the earth. Someone needed to claim the fourth spot and Atlanta ended up being that team. Now, the Wizards are (hopefully) healthy, the Pistons and Raptors are reloaded and Chicago might be brimming with confidence after their own seven-game upset bid fell just short. The point is, any internal improvements the Hawks make seem likely to be counteracted by the return of several other Eastern Conference teams to the picture.
This isn't to say the Hawks stink. They're a pretty good team with some very solid talent. Like the Wizards, they're pretty deep in rotation-quality players, with nine guys (the starters, Crawford, Zaza Pachulia, Mo Evans and Joe Smith) who belong in a playoff team's rotation. It's just that they're ceiling has probably been reached.
So get ready for more of the same in Atlanta. Get ready for Woodson to overwork Joe Johnson to the point where he again becomes the game's most overrated featured player instead of one of the league's best complimentary scorers. Get ready for the Hawks to switch every screen, putting Mike Bibby on bigger players in terrible spots on the floor. Get ready for Josh Smith to tantalize, but then leave you with something more. Get ready for Al Horford's solid contributions to go unnoticed by his own coach.
The end result is a team that plays pretty well, but always leaves you wondering whether they can do something more. Just like last year.
My prediction: 47-35, third in the Southeast, fifth in the East.
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I agree they just make it
But the fact that Atlanta Hawks were able to make the second round of the playoffs is an indictment of the quality of the Eastern Conference. 4-the rest of the Eastern Conference is very fluid.
I am glad the Hawks won a series and revived the NBA scene down there and I was especially glad for Mike Woodson.
"Would you like to shoot me now or wait till you get home." --- Daffy Duck
by George Templeton on Aug 18, 2009 10:41 AM EDT reply actions
I think that's too optimistic
These guys are moving backwards by standing still. At least two or three of the Wizards, Pistons, Bulls, and Heat will pass them. Woodson’s not good enough to get any more out of this squad. In short, I agree with the story you have on them, but I see them being 6th or 7th.
time to get nice and bias
hawks backcourt- not improved.
But Marvin and Horford are almost sure fire to improve. Marvin has history (both his own where he has improved every year) and others (where other small forwards have started the peak of their career at his age and experience). Horford works hard and still has lots of room for growth.
Josh Smith will only improve if he gains some humility (and he realizes he should stop shooting jumpers and start rebounding) but real improvement is there if he does.
and as far as other teams improving in the east, the bulls and the heat did not. They might have done worse than stand still.
all that blustery Hawk talk is to say I think Mike’s 47 wins prediction is about right, but I think the Hawks will do/have what it takes to get the 4th seed again.
I agree that Williams and Horford will "improve" next year
I just question whether that improvement will translate to any significant improvement for the team on the court with a Mike Woodson-coached team. I doubt Marvin will suddenly become a featured player and I doubt Horford’s suddenly going to get 20-25 touches a game in the post with Woodson at the helm, so all we’re going to see are marginal improvements in the way they play their roles.
You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.
I'll Second That
Anybody that agrees with our Bird-Watcher collective thoughts about the team (too much guard play, not enough Horford, Josh Smith needs a basketball lobotomy) gets my vote to create the gameplan.
My prediction
45-37 5th in the East, 3rd in the Southeast
I can’t see this team matching or improving on last year but I don’t see them dropping far either. I think Jamal Crawford is a slight upgrade over Murray but outside of that they have stayed the same while their competition in the East has gotten better. I also don’t think that Mike Woodson can get any more out of that team. He has talent at every position but his offensive system doesnt allow everyone to get involved in the half-court. Its mostly just dribble and pass around a little and then after the floor spacing is all messed up and the shot clock is running down, throw it to Joe Johnson.
I could see a coaching change if things don’t start out well in Atlanta.
Agree with lj15
45-37 5th in the East (behind the Wizards 3rd, and Boston 4th) – and 3rd in the Southeast
This team is young, deep and talented… but being held back by their Coach and the star player (Josh Smith)… They have enough depth to withstand the normal injuries a team goes through during a season… I like the Jamal Crawford pickup. But Josh Smith will manage to lose some games for them (while still managing to “get his” 18 and 8, with highlight dunks and blocks)…
Bullets Forever - where "Dagger ! " happens......
50 wins and Mike Woodson shows up
Mike Woodson will show up with an uptempo spread the ball philosophy this year. I approximated that it would take him three years to develop and implement it himself and this is that year. so look out for an offense run through marvin to joe and then a split of josh and al.
No seriously without a Mike Woodson epiphany I still see this team hitting that 50 win mark.
Atlanta Did Right
I don’t think they are putting stock in either Williams, Smith, or Horford improving substantially as individuals … but perhaps, if each makes small strides, it can be substantial as a whole.
Still …. they will need to have some fight and a dash of luck to even compete for the fourth spot in the East.
But can we blame Atlanta for the moves they made this summer? No. They did what they had to do in retaining Williams, Bibby, and Pachulia. The franchise has been on thin ice in Atlanta for a while … and just when they are starting to win them over with some exciting youngsters is when they absolutely cannot afford to take a step backwards.
Sure, they may just move laterally this season … but at this point, simply staying competitive is much more important.
Prediction: 45 wins
Representing DC with Wizards & Stuff - Truth About It.net and Bullets Forever.
Crudely applying WS
Crawford for Murray is a wash. Smith is ok, but not really an upgrade. They slightly overachieved last year. I don’t see where their improvement comes from. Put me down for 45 wins as well.
At least as good as last year
And I don’t think the comp has really improved around them. I’d say 48 wins.

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