somebody buy this team a compass

by stlballa on Mar 5, 2009 2:17 PM EST Comment 67 comments

theres no apparent direction for this team. give every fan a compass at the gate and see if any of them work once they sit down in the vortex center.

is just so frustrating to watch this team this year. They don't seem to be doing anything to make us better in the long run. How come Tapscott isnt playing any of these young guys in a meaningful manner. I know its unfortunate in professional sports but sometimes the whole good of a franchise takes presentant over an individual. On this team thier are certian guys that are not going to be here long term. Why not tire javale,andray ,nick, taser, crit when the game is young, giving them important minutes and then put james, songiala, etc in down the stretch. the vets wont like it, but hey be better, youve had the whole season to prove you can keep us in games, just go cash your check. Im not saying to bench jamison or butler at all. But GIVE THEM A NIGHT OFF every once in a while. What good is it for anybody to run jamison out there every night for 38.5 minutes. We have this guy signed long term, hes not getting younger, dont waste his legs anymore than you have too.

The Fans:

I can see a counter argument from an operating perspective. the fans are paying for a product and we should give them the best we can. wake up: Nobody going to a wizards game expects to see a great product this year. But they should expect an exciting product. We have a slew of exciting young guys can deliver that. My counterpunch: That is what people are going to the games: These young guys. I honestly would rather see Javale McGee block the air out of a ball and then get an alley oop from NY and finish with 15pts, or see taser hit 5 outside jumpshots then i would like to see jamison score 20 and 10. Because I will leave the arena excited about what I saw. hopeful about the future.

Its ashame that this season has gone the way it has. However, itll be more of ashame if we don't sqweeze the most out of the last 22 games.

This represents the view of the user who wrote the FanPost, and not the entire Bullets Forever community. We're a place of many opinions, not just one.

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yeah but

It’s exciting to see the young guys play – sometimes it is at least (it can look ugly too) – but I also like to see the Wizards compete. And the more I watch the team the more convinced I am that if the Wizards just threw buckets of minutes at their young prospects than they would be even worse than they are now.

It can also be argued that McGuire, Crittenton and Blatche already do get good minutes. Enough that I no longer buy the argument that Tapscott’s not playing his young guys enough. As bad as that team is, minutes are available for anyone that earns them. I’d like to see a player like Nick Young earn some minutes, but frankly he hasn’t played well enough.

by Johnnie Futbol on Mar 5, 2009 4:15 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

How much worse can this team get?

if the Wizards just threw buckets of minutes at their young prospects than they would be even worse than they are now.

They’re the worst team in the league! How much worse could they get if they just fully committed to a youth movement?

And improvement doesn’t come overnight. You need to be given a chance to fail.

This cannot be a question of “earning” minutes anymore. This is a question of what makes the most sense for the franchise long-term. Having Mike James and Darius Songaila play over 30 minutes every game does nothing.

It’s really quite simple. Cut both their minutes in half. Give 10 of those 15 minutes from James to Nick; the other five go to Critt. Give 10 extra minutes to McGee and five to Blatche. It’s all about individual player development right now, and to develop as a player, you need to be given a chance to fail so you can work to succeed. As Rook has mentioned so many times here, the only player who has been given that chance this year is McGuire.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 4:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Only McGuire?

I’d argue that along with McGuire both Blatche and Crittenton are getting pretty significant minutes on the court, more than enough for them to improve. Again, those three together are proof that young guys can get PT if they earn the time. I also believe that to some degree you want your players earning minutes, so you don’t just give ’em out based primarily on how young you are – i.e. what you do on the court actually matters.

Nick Young’s failures – and I don’t mean to suggest I’ve given up on him – can’t be explained by his lack of playing time. That’s an excuse. He just hasn’t matured enough as a player, and I don’t believe giving him another 5 or 10 minutes per game would really make that much of a difference.

And how bad could this already awful team get if they went with a youth movement? Even more awful. Isn’t that enough?

by Johnnie Futbol on Mar 5, 2009 5:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Then how about just consistent minutes?

The problem for me isn’t that NY gets no PT, it’s that sometimes he gets a lot and sometimes none at all. You could argue that he gets minutes when he produces, but as I’ve said elsewhere, a.) guys like Mike James (and even Blatche to a certain extent) get a lot of minutes when they’re playing poorly, and b.) Tap and the rest of the coaching staff should find ways to make NY productive even when he’s not scoring.

Especially that last bit, giving Young time when he scores but not when he doesn’t seems like the worst way to help him round out his game. If he knows he’s only going to stay out there if he gets buckets, then that’s all he’s going to look to do.

by Jon L on Mar 5, 2009 5:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

What does NY do well except score, which I think he actually doesn’t do well. He doesn’t help the offense without the ball, he doesn’t help the D, he doesn’t help others offense when he has the ball, he doesn’t rebound particularly well.

The problem is that he is a one dimensional player.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 5:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Which is exactly why the coaches need to help him improve in other areas

and let him learn how to improve in those areas on the floor.

by Jon L on Mar 5, 2009 5:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe

We’ve been through this before. You may be right.

But if Taps is using minutes as a motivator then it all makes sense. Perhaps he is reluctant to reward a player that refuses to learn.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 6:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Do we really need to start this again?

rockin' the crab dribble since 2009

by hibachi on Mar 5, 2009 6:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Nope

I will say that we all seem to agree on the other guy’s minutes. NY’s minutes is really the sticking point.

If the minutes of a single second year player on a 14-47 team is the only major disagreement, then I think we’re doing pretty well.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 6:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

McGee's minutes have annoyed me more, actually

All our bigs are hurt, and he still can’t get off the bench. It’s crazy.

Sure he makes mistakes, but we’re 14-47, let him grow through them. You can argue at least that Nick doesn’t try to fix his mistakes and demonstrates a poor capacity to learn, but can you really say the same thing about McGee?

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 6:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

can you really say the same thing about McGee?

Not at all. But McGee’s minutes have been growing, no?

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 6:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Not really

He’s cracked 15 minutes just once in the last eight games.

Which is just staggering to me. What is the harm in playing him? His instincts are all off … he’s chastised for not being able to play the p&r, but he’s never had experience having to do that. Is it really surprising that he can’t defend the p&r when he came from Nevada and is so raw? What will sitting and learning do?

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 6:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You are right

I agree with you. I’ve said all along that if I were coach I’d be playing McG another 5 minutes a game and in the last 15-20 games of the season I’d bump him up farther.

But I’m not the coach. Taps is. He’s been developing young players for a long long time. So if he thinks the best way for our very young very raw talent is to make them watch, I guess I just give him the benefit of the doubt.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 7:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Well

And how bad could this already awful team get if they went with a youth movement? Even more awful. Isn’t that enough?

I dispute this, number one (is Nick really much worse than James, if he’s worse at all?). Number two, why does it matter? What’s the difference between 20-62 and 17-65?

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 6:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But NY’s minutes aren’t coming at the expense of James minutes. James is playing very little SG, and when he does he loses most of his bad habits. We could cut James’ minutes and it would likely mean more minutes for Crit (which is fine). To get NY more minutes McGuire or Butler would have to play less. Unless you want NY at the point.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 6:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

No, you play Critt/Young more than you do

So Young is taking James’ minutes, but Critt’s minutes are staying the same/going up.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 6:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

So you are cutting James’ SG minutes.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 7:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Which is fine by me

Again, long-term growth over short-term gain.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 7:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Now we get a chicken/egg debate that will never be solved

Did Blatche and Critt really “earn” minutes? Per-minute, nothing has changed with them. Certainly, nothing negative.

It seems to me that it’s the other way around … they played better because they received more minutes. At the very least, if we’re even having this discussion, it throws the whole “they earned minutes” out the window. We don’t know if they’ve really earned minutes. All we’ve learned is they’ve earned minutes according to the Tao of Ed Tapscott. That’s not exactly a ringing endorsement to me.

What I’m basically saying is that the whole “earn your minutes” thing, much like the argument against the validity of per-minute numbers in the basketball community, assumes the coach is perfect. It assumes the coach knows exactly how to get the most out of his team. In essence, it proves Ed Tapscott is a great coach. I don’t know anyone who would come anywhere close to making that argument.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 6:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Also...

Songalia doesn’t play 30 mins per game. It’s more like 20.

That said, I would be happy to see Mike James’ minutes drop, though I don’t think that would necessarily help the team, I don’t think more minutes for Nick Young is the solution to his problems, and I still think the argument that the Wizards desperately need a youth movement is entirely overblown.

by Johnnie Futbol on Mar 5, 2009 5:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree with Johnnie.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 5:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Sure

Great post, summed up my feelings even better than a michael richards stand-up routine

Its unfathomable that darius songaila is still playing minutes. I would rather the wizards signed phil chenier to a 10-day contract to see what the old guys got. If darius songaila isn’t a 7th man in the yugoslavian league next year then theres something seriously wrong with the game of basketball.

by Wooz on Mar 5, 2009 5:41 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Songila is probably our most sound player. He cuts the lane. He passes to cutters. He sets up his man inside. He slips outside for his almost automatic 18 footer. He helps well on D and gets back to his man quickly. He gets his hand on the ball and disrupts.

Having McG and Blatche watch him is incredibly valuable. If one of those guys played the mental game as well as Songila they would be an all star.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 5:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Songaila's been very solid for us.

by RamVA on Mar 5, 2009 6:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Five Songilas would beat the current Wizards team.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 6:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Songalia

He’d be a lot better if he didn’t so often play out of position. But I agree he’s more sound of a player than he’s given credit for.

by Johnnie Futbol on Mar 5, 2009 6:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But five Songailas don't help us with long-term growth

They may help us win more this year, but there’s no point … we’re 14-47.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 6:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Songaila is a solid back-up PF, but last night he had two rebounds in 30 minutes.

by antawnjameson on Mar 5, 2009 6:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I disagree

Does anyone dispute that Songila is having a career year?

Don’t you think that will make the team better next year?

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 6:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Why would it?

You know what you get from Darius.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 7:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

He’s better this year than he was last year or the year before.

He’s not a machine. I think he still gets better too.

Just this year he’s finishing around the basket better, including the reverse layup.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 7:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But who is more likely to make a big jump because of more playing time to show his stuff

A 30-year old non-athletic Darius Songaila, or a 21-year old JaVale McGee?

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 7:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Songaila

Here’s my formula:
Probability of improvement x probability that he gets more playing time

McGee = .95 x .001(Probability that Butler, Jamison, Blatche, Pech, McGuire are injured at the same time, and that Peter John Ramos declines the Wizards 10-day contract offer) = .00095
Songaila=.005 x .45(Probability that Tapscott finds his scented markers)= .00225

by morethesamewiz on Mar 5, 2009 7:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I was narrowly responding to this post: “They may help us win more this year, but there’s no point … we’re 14-47.”

and this post: “Its unfathomable that darius songaila is still playing minutes”

I think there IS a point to letting Songila get better.

The issue of McGee’s minutes is another discussion entirely.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 10:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Well, not really

Because more minutes for McGee should mean less minutes for Songaila.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 5, 2009 10:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Right

I get that.

However this sub-thread is about how it is “unfathomable that darius songaila is still playing minutes” and how his minutes should go to Phil Chenier. So I was not addressing the issue of McGee’s minutes, which could come from a lot of places, including DS.

I agree that McGee should get more minutes. The thing I disagreed with was that a) Songila was terrible b) Songila doesn’t improve c) Songila’s improvement is meaningless.

by MR on Mar 5, 2009 10:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Ultimately even if he’s improving it doesn’t matter, he’s thirty, has a terrible contract and when the Wizards most likely draft another big man he’s going to get minutes that should go to the rookie. Not to mention his rebounding rate is horrid for a PF, 8 percent, a career low . A decent role player sure, but if Blake Griffin comes this way, I’d be happy to see Songaila sit.

by Fundefined on Mar 5, 2009 11:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

8 percent is bad for a shooting guard

I mean, Javaris Crittenton has a higher REB% than Songaila. That’s unbelievable.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 6, 2009 1:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Songaila Rebounding Facts

13- the most rebounds Darius Songaila’s pulled down in a game in his career, in 43 minutes against the New York Knicks in his 2003-2004 rookie season.

12- the number of double-doubles in Songaila’s career

2/20-2/24/2004
Songaila has three consecutive double-doubles.

January 20th, 2006- Songaila’s most recent double double.

December 22nd, 2007- The lone time Darius Songaila has gotten double-digit rebounds (8 pts, 10 rebounds) in his time with the Wizards.

January 31st, 2009- the last time Songaila got 5 or more rebounds.

7- the number of times Songaila got 5 or more rebounds this season. Has pulled down 7 three times, and pulled down 5 four times.

by morethesamewiz on Mar 6, 2009 3:02 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Who Cares?

I mean, Javaris Crittenton has a higher REB% than Songaila. That’s unbelievable.

Why do you always harp on Songaila’s individual rebounding, as if that’s the only thing that matters in a forward? Last time I looked, the most important stat was on the scoreboard, and I don’t mean personal fouls. Songaila’s +/- per minute numbers this season are still second best on this pitiful team, behind only Nick Young and way ahead of Caron Butler or Antawn Jamison’s. Plus, in the past 10 games, his +/- per minute numbers have gotten even better, while Nick Young’s have gotten much worse. So the Wizards are a much better team when Songaila’s on the floor, and still you harp on individual rebounding?

From the New York Times article on Shane Battier:

How many points a player scores, for example, is no true indication of how much he has helped his team. Another example: if you want to know a player’s value as a rebounder, you need to know not whether he got a rebound but the likelihood of the team getting the rebound when a missed shot enters that player’s zone.
…
He pointed out how, instead of grabbing uncertainly for a rebound, for instance, Battier would tip the ball more certainly to a teammate. Guarding a lesser rebounder, Battier would, when the ball was in the air, leave his own man and block out the other team’s best rebounder. "Watch him," a Houston front-office analyst told me before the game. "When the shot goes up, he’ll go sit on Gasol’s knee."

Ever notice how Darius is one of the only guys on this terrible team that boxes out? He literally clears the lane for everybody else on this team, and still you fault him for individual rebounding? Don’t you have any team stats you can show me? I’d love to see them. There has to be some reason why this team is much better when he is on the floor.

BTW, Songaila’s rebounding per 36 minutes for his career is 6.7. Shane Battier’s is 5.1. Javaris Crittenton has a better rebounding percentage than Battier too. So clearly Daryl Morey is an idiot, right, because he lets Battier play even though he is such a terrible individual rebounder?

Another BTW, JaVale McGee has improved his play somewhat, and now owns only the 2nd worst +/- per minute on this team. In the past 10 games, his +/- per minute has been better than Oleksiy Pecherov and Juan Dixon, but worse than everybody else. You know what? He played more minutes than both of those guys. Maybe if he did more of the little things that makes his team better, rather than focus on his individual stat line, he might see more minutes?

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on Mar 9, 2009 9:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sorry for the Tone

Re-reading this, I realize that I came off as more bitingly sarcastic than I intended. It is just a pet peeve of mine to see someone criticize a good team player because of poor individual stats. Songaila is a good PF and a very versatile, all-around player, and I don’t feel he gets enough credit for what he adds to this team.

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on Mar 9, 2009 9:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well

The problem with the Songaila as our Shane Battier argument is as follows:

1. Songaila doesn’t actually improve team rebounding performance, according to 82games. They grab 50.3% of available rebounds when he’s in, 50.3% when he’s out.

2. His adjusted plus/minus hasn’t traditionally been this strong. Last year, it was basically even. In terms of rebounding, the Wizards rebounded way less with him on the court than with him off it.

3. His 06/07 adjusted plus/minus was actually in the negative.

It’s hard to judge adjusted plus/minus as a one-year trend, particularly with a veteran like Songaila. (That’s why I think Blatche and Young’s strong +/- numbers are more encouraging … they’re young enough to keep that up). Every other year here indicates Songaila is an average player that doesn’t, in fact, help out the team’s ability to rebound.

Therefore, I will make fun of his lack of rebounding. He does things well, rebounding just ain’t one of them.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 9, 2009 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That's a Problem?

So you say that there is no difference in rebounding when Darius is on the court (actually, there is a slight improvement, albeit a minuscule amount), then you continue to make fun of his rebounding? Obviously, the team does not suffer at all in the rebounding department when he is on the floor. For every rebound he doesn’t grab, he creates a rebounding oppurtunity for someone else. So why is he a liability again? That very link (thanks for that, BTW) shows how the Wizards are a better shooting team when Darius is on the floor with more assisted field goals. I don’t see any liability from that link at all.

You say he was not as good the past couple of seasons compared to his healthy teammates. I’m thinking – duh! The Wizards were better the last couple of seasons all around, and yet Darius still had the 5th highest net on/off court on the entire team, better than even Gilbert Arenas! Of course, when he was off the court, the Wizards were only slightly worse last season, instead of much worse this season. Was this supposed to make Darius look bad?

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on Mar 9, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Another Thing

Wizards net team rebounding percentage this season when Antawn Jamison is on the floor: +0.5%.

Wizards net team rebounding percentage this season when Caron Butler is on the floor: -1.1%.

Why don’t you make fun of their rebounding? They clearly don’t help the team that much in this department.

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on Mar 9, 2009 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, those guys rebound well individually

I think you’re making your point for me. For Songaila’s poor rebounding to be ignored, he’d have to make a significant contribution to the team’s rebounding. He doesn’t. Therefore, it isn’t ignored.

I don’t think Darius is a liability, dude. He has his strengths; his high adjusted plus/minus is proof of that. He’s just a terrible rebounder. I don’t think that’s disputable.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 9, 2009 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm Not on Your Wavelength Yet

Well, those guys rebound well individually

I think you’re making your point for me. For Songaila’s poor rebounding to be ignored, he’d have to make a significant contribution to the team’s rebounding.

What good is individual rebounding if it doesn’t help the team? What bad is it if it doesn’t hurt the team? Who cares what a player’s individual number is unless it shows up on the scoreboard somehow? I know you don’t think Songaila is a liability overall, but you still seem to imply that he is with regard to his rebounding. But the statistics, at least the way I am interpreting them, dispute this.

The Wizards are not a better rebounding team when Songaila is not on the floor, so what does it matter if he grabs 2 rebounds or 20? Who cares if Jamison grabs 12 rebounds if the team would have gotten those 12 rebounds anyway? And I could care less if Butler’s individual rebounding is good for his position if it means the team suffers at rebounding while he is in the game. Basketball is still considered a team sport, though admittedly less so in the NBA.

Do you care if Songaila gets a rebound instead of another Wizard? What difference does it make?

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on Mar 9, 2009 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

This Surprised Me

Wizards net team rebounding percentage this season when Dominic McGuire is on the floor: +0.3%.

I would have never guessed. So apparently Taser helps the team rebound about as well as Darius Songaila.

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on Mar 9, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yes i do

what is this statement based on? Not stats, because he’s had a better scoring average in 3 seasons, has never rebounded this poorly, and is at his 2 lowest PER in his career (only “topped” by last year’s horrid 11)

And certainly not by watching the wizards play, he last lost almost all of the already limited mobility he had making him useless on defense and with his jumper no longer falling, he has nothing to provide on offense.

by Wooz on Mar 6, 2009 2:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

in response to...

MR’s claim that songaila is having a career season

by Wooz on Mar 6, 2009 2:53 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

please dont duplicate songailas

just the thought of a starting 5 of straight songailas is hilarious

by stlballa on Mar 6, 2009 2:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

MR

at this point its obvious to me that MR is some how related to darius songaila. Hes made more outrageous claims than jeff van gundy writing a sexual exploit novel.

Songaila WAS a decent at best player. At one time he deserved some minutes, and was actually mildly effective on offense. But if you watch him this year, he is absolutely terrible. Watching darius songaila try to box out any other frontcourt player this side of yaroslav koralev is an uglier sight than walking in on ben wallace spooning with chris wilcox.

Darius songaila is arguably the worst player in the nba this year. If he wasnt playing center he might not be at that level, but why throw him out there to get killed and hurt the team? Give the minutes to anyone else. If not phil chenier, I would rather the wizards signed the tallest guy in dc and let him have a shot.

At this point, the best thing that can happen is that songaila gets run over by a bus and insurance picks up his contract and it comes off the salary cap. I know that sounds harsh, but with gil and haywood out we cant go soft.

by Wooz on Mar 6, 2009 2:52 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Come on

You don’t need that first paragraph.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 6, 2009 3:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Your alleged humor undercuts whatever point you are trying to make.

Could his rebounding numbers be worse because he is rebounding against centers instead of PFs and SFs like the past?

I’m not the only one here who likes Songila. I don’t think he is starting quality, but that is the tale of 08-09 in DC. I don’t think he should be starting over Blatche either. The only point I have made here is that Songila’s game benefits from additional minutes just like other players and that his high usage this year will make him a better player during his 10 minutes a game next year.

Please stop mis-representing what I say and then calling me crazy.

by MR on Mar 6, 2009 6:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Could his rebounding numbers be worse because he is rebounding against centers instead of PFs and SFs like the past?

His rebounding percentage hasn’t topped 11.5% since his rookie year. That’s pitifully bad for a big man.

Plus, Eddie did play him a lot at center even when we had more guys available, because Eddie is dumb.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 6, 2009 11:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Please stop using words like "improve" and "better" for Songaila

Songaila is 31 years old, and rare is the NBA player who improves at that age, and even rarer the frontcourt player. In fact, his scoring average this year (6.8 points per game) is right in line with his career average (6.9) and his rebounding rate has been in an overall decline ever since the ‘03-’04 season (13.1-11.5-10.6-11.0-10.2).

Also, he’s rebounding better as a center this year than he as as a PF, though I suspect that partly due to him seeing more time at the pivot.

Frankly I think it’s a little ridiculous to say that playing Songaila a lot will make him better when/if he plays less next year. At best, he’s going to give the same consistent production he always has, but there are multiple signs that there’s nowhere for him to go but down.

by Jon L on Mar 6, 2009 12:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i do agree

with everything you said. i just dont know why someone would stand behind songaila with such steadfast determination. Heres the deal…Songaila can help this team next year, if we are healthy and he comes off the bench and plays well. He has a role on this team, however do you feel that his play will drop off significantly if we give some of his minutes to a younger player for the last 20 games? and allow said player to develop this year and help the team even more next season? Songaila might be a victim of being a sound fundamental player on a team with little of his kind. Im saying i think hes gonna be the same no matter how much or little he plays and that isnt the case for some others who need some court time. again long term or short gain.

by stlballa on Mar 6, 2009 2:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

My statements are being serially misrepresented and/or misunderstood

A poster (Wooz) stated that he would rather see Phil Chenier play than Songila. This same person later said he hopes Songila would get run over by a bus.

I would prefer Songila play his 20 minutes a game this year than see Chenier suit up and I would rather see Songila fulfill his Wizards contract than be killed or maimed by public transport of any kind.

If that is steadfast determination then fine, guilty as charged.

McGee’s and Blatche’s were not part of this conversation until later brought up and I agreed that McGee should play more. I have previously stated that I think Blatche should be starting again now that he is injury free. Furthermore, I have been saying for several months that McGee should be playing more minutes and that in the final 15-20 games he should be playing even more.

I hope that clears things up so that we can begin talking about how badly we are going to get spanked tonight in SA.

by MR on Mar 6, 2009 3:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

So you're basically saying

Play McGee more, start Blatche, and keep Songaila in the regular rotation playing similar minutes to what he’s playing now.

That’s just not possible. For someone’s minutes to grow, someone else’s need to drop.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 6, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Actually all I’m saying is don’t replace him with Chenier or run him over.

by MR on Mar 6, 2009 3:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

That was really worth a comment?

Clearly Wooz was kidding around. It’s one thing to make silly unserious suggestions like that; it’s another to actually respond to them.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 6, 2009 3:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

im only kidding around about running over songaila, i would love to see if chenier still has any game. It could be some kind of promotional night to increase revenue so we can go over the luxury tax next year. Innovative thinking. And for one night we wont’ have to worry about buckhantz’ mic picking up the creaking in songaila’s knees when he “runs” upcourt for the “fast” break

by Wooz on Mar 6, 2009 4:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

mcgee

Here’s my thought process on why McGee isn’t playing as much and similar with Crit.

I think (and I don’t necessarily agree with) that the team would rather see 15-20 good minutes out of a guy with less mistakes and issues or 30 minutes where the last ten are filled with more errors.

I think what Tapscott and Ernie are looking for are good, QUALITY minutes out of the young guys and when that stops you see them being pulled. You don’t want to see the same mistakes made over and over again by the younger guys. At this point what you get out of James and Songaila might be what you get so if those guys make errors well they aren’t part of the long term plan so they aren’t as worried.

With the younger guys its more about QUALITY minutes than QUANTITY.

Now obviously that might mean something different to us than them. But when JaVale played well against the pick and roll according to tapscott a few games back he got 32 minutes. Now personally I didn’t see a huge difference but maybe that’s why I’m blogging and he’s coaching.

Just my 2 cents

by igetbucketsson on Mar 6, 2009 2:25 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

i understand that

i can appreciate why tapscott would prefer a relatively mistake free player like songaila to a young guy like mcgee. Songaila might make the smart plays in the game but he never has and never will make the impactful ones. Mcgee and blatche have the chance to make those plays, and theyll only ever stop making the dumb ones with time and experience.

The season has been lost for a long time, whats the difference between 20 wins and 18? The Heat had 15 wins last season and look at them this year. The wizards are not that far away from being competitive, but we need the young guys to step up, so why keep hindering them?

by Wooz on Mar 6, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Part of the problem when you have a losing team is the games mean less and its easier to fall into bad habits, and the last thing this team can want is the young guys learning bad habits.

Again I think this is the thought process because it makes the most sense. Its not like they don’t want to see the young guys succeed or improve and win more games.

Now maybe their leash should get longer, I don’t know, I don’t know what mistakes they see because coaches see the game differently than I do. But I do know that when JaVale’s in the game I notice the other team getting much more open looks near the basket on what have to be defensive breakdowns. But I also see a guy that can change shots and run and make great plays.

by igetbucketsson on Mar 6, 2009 4:40 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I'm also sure it's the thought process

I also think they’re worrying too much about bad habits. If they start demonstrating bad habits, you can coach them out of it while still playing them.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Mar 6, 2009 4:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Lastly

I think its also good to note that these guys still saw much more time than they would have ever gotten had we been healthy.

Critt’s playing 20 minutes a game, JaVale’s playing 15-20 minutes per game. Dom’s starting, Dray’s getting minutes

Those are some heavy minutes, and if the guys want those kind of minutes next year when this team is healthy they’d better bring their A game.

by igetbucketsson on Mar 6, 2009 4:52 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

great wrap up buckets

it was a very heated thread and I feel that comment above is very true in the sense that are young guys in retrospect ARE getting decent minutes, perhaps even substantive and they will have to definitely find their niche on this team. The thing is all of our youngs will only be asked to fill a concentrated specific role for next years team. Yes i think we all agree that we see potential for even more minutes for these young guuys to develop thier overall game. But honestly next year we should only asking for them to do one or two things:
soem examples…
Dom.- come off the bench and give butler a blow and while your out thier make thier stud small forward work like hell to get a basket. then when butler comes back his man will be tired.
Blatche.- Energy. I wish I was could realistically ask for more but i dont know what youve proven to be above average at (perhaps someone on this post can insert something here) Hopefully Tapscott will give you an offseason assignment such as boxing out and working for offensive rebounding or somethign along those lines.
NY-. scoring off the bench
McGee- I feel he can improve enough in the offseason to warrant serious minutes with the first team
crit- just keep doing what your doing keep building that good chemistry with the young crew and try to lead a controlled fury while your out thier with the second unit.

For the betterment of the team I hope the wizards management team pulls our youngs aside after the season and lets them know what we are gonna need out of them next year and maybe its not the best for thier overall development of thier game but thier is honor in doing one or two things exceptional and helping a team win. The patriots have been doing this for years. Giving thier players a specific task to perform and see if they can take that task to the next level.

I commend MR for his devotion to a wizard player. it truly shows your dedication to this team. something i feel everyone on this site obviously shares with you in spades. i dont want my thread to be the source of a riff in any cost. i believe the season has taken its toll on us (well me, ill speak for myself)
and that frustration resulted in songailas name being dropped more than britney spears baby. I hope the players especially songiala dont stumble ont this site/thread.

by stlballa on Mar 7, 2009 2:22 PM EST reply actions 0 recs