Antawn Jamison Dilemma

by Carlos Returns on Oct 29, 2009 12:07 PM EDT Comment 30 comments

I know we are one game into the season but...

What if the Wizards continue to do well? What if the conventional line up with a "power" forward proves to work out? What happens with Antawn Jamison?

Option 1: We "Lamar Odom" Antawn. We turn him into a super sub, who plays super minutes from the bench.

Option 2: We start Antawn regardless. We take what we love about Antawn; perimeter shooting, rebounding, and consistency, and we take the bad; poor defense and lack of power, lack of presence.

Option 3: We trade Antawn (maybe package) for a more conventional power forward upgrade from Oberto and Blatche (though if he continues to do what he did against the Mavs...look out). I understand it would be difficult given the lack of power big men available and Antawn's unappetizing contract.

I am seriously at a loss. I love Antawn Jamison for who he is. He is a great leader. He is solid. I just don't know if he makes us championship caliber against the bigs in the East. I never thought we were a better team without Gilbert, but I always wondered if we would be better without Antawn.

Thoughts...

This represents the view of the user who wrote the FanPost, and not the entire Bullets Forever community. We're a place of many opinions, not just one.

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You said it all

It’s been one game. We’re that much better if Andray can put up that kind of production behind Antawn.

Neither guy is in a contract year, we’d be paying the tax anyway. Until further notice, there’s no reason to even consider moving him.

by bronco6778 on Oct 29, 2009 12:23 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Also

I’m not worried about Flip managing egos. No doubt he got a Masters course on that in Detroit.

by bronco6778 on Oct 29, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I Don't See a Problem With Antawn

Orlando proved you don’t need a typical power forward to advance far in the playoffs. Rashard Lewis is like Antawn in many ways. Neither are going to bowl anybody over in the paint, but both have proven to be effective contributors to their teams.

Also, let’s see how Antawn does in our new defensive system before we assume he’s going to be a weak link. Rashard’s defense doesn’t hurt his team’s that much. Is Antawn’s individual defense that much worse than his?

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on Oct 29, 2009 12:30 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs

Agree with this

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Oct 29, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't know about the Rashard Lewis comparison

Rashard’s not a great defender, but he’s like 6’10 and his length lets him both a lot of guys. Most teams don’t have two power big men who can score much, so it doesn’t really matter that much that he can’t guard Carlos Boozer or Tim Duncan.

by pantslessyoda1 on Oct 30, 2009 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Lewis is an above-average defender at PF.

SF is a different story, but Rashard doesn’t play there much.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Oct 31, 2009 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I can't speak for Jamison but I can for Lewis and he's a net positive, defensively.

That’s really why Orlando’s 4-out/1-in offensive philosophy works, because of Rashard.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Oct 31, 2009 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Since You're From TQC

I’ll let you critique Mike’s analysis after the NBA Finals last summer. I agree 100% with it, and it’s become the basis from which I argue against those who say, “so-and-so is not a good individual defender, therefore he can’t contribute to a good defense.” Seriously, did you ever think Rashard was a good defender when he played for the Sonics? Yet he’s a key contributor to your outstanding defense because of a great scheme and great coaching, IMO.

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on Nov 2, 2009 9:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

AJ is in another stratosphere of bad defense from Lewis

by BayAreaBullet on Nov 11, 2009 6:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

There is no dilemma

just one game down, 81 to go.

by MR on Oct 29, 2009 12:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Glad you posted this

I also am interested to see what happens when he comes back. not how flip uses him (he’s going to start, no question) but like cuppettcj says – let’s see how he looks in the new defensive system.
I am skeptical that he would have harassed Dirk as much as Oberto/Blatche did. But, I’m definitely willing to give him a chance to prove himself.

"a crab dribble is when you travel" - caron butler

by little stevie colter on Oct 29, 2009 1:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

It might be too early to have this discussion . . .

but that’s never stopped me before!

A. Jamison will grumble and at the first sign of a losing streak his grumbling might get louder

B. Changing a winning team to suit one guy (especially one who is defensively challenged) might cause a problem in the locker room.

C. Does anyone in this environment want Jamison’s contract (that price and that length?)

"Would you like to shoot me now or wait till you get home." --- Daffy Duck

by George Templeton on Oct 29, 2009 2:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

When has Jamison ever grumbled about his role on any team?

Remember, he did go to Dallas as a bench player and won Sixth Man of the Year. He’s the type of guy (in my opinion) who will do what’s best for the team, as long as you give him a good argument as to why it’s so good for the team.

"One-on-one? You can't." -Gilbert Arenas
JC Bandwagon all day!

by kseandoyle on Oct 29, 2009 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

In fact in Dallas he grumbled often about it

but when things went so well he eventually buttoned his lip about it. And as someone else pointed out on here, when EJ had Jamison come of the bench for a couple games in 2005 (might’ve been in 2006) he didn’t like it and gently said so to the media.

"Would you like to shoot me now or wait till you get home." --- Daffy Duck

by George Templeton on Oct 30, 2009 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

35 year old AJ is due to make 15 mil/yr

i feel like this isn’t getting enough breath here

that’s 2005 money – this isn’t a 2005 economic climate with a 2005 salary cap.

he and gil will account for 34 mil worth of guaranteed money in 11/12. The 09/10 cap is 57.7 – i’ve heard it’ll be lower in 10/11. this is not a good situation

what’s the track record for rebounding rates for 35 year old power forwards? just saying…

by chrisrdowd on Nov 1, 2009 11:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

AJ Showed No Signs of His Production Tapering Off Before He Got Hurt

And there really is no reason to speculate that it will at this point. Let him come back, throw him back out there, and see what happens. I’m not losing any sleep over this.

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on Nov 2, 2009 9:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

yup. that 4th year is gonna hurt.

by DarrellWalkerFan on Nov 5, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

By then, he'll be expiring, so it'll help his value

I actually think the third year hurts more than the fourth. Jamison’s basically untradeable then.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on Nov 5, 2009 12:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Doesnt make sense to me

The “move Jamison to the bench” and “Trade Jamison” opinions have never made sense to me, especially when they are extra knee-jerk like this one. I would think that Wizards fans would’nt undervalue Jamison as much as the outsiders do but I guess thats not the case.

by lj15 on Oct 29, 2009 6:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Trading Jamison wouldn't be hard

As the deadline was approaching last year, Grunfeld took many calls from teams looking for Jamison, turning them all down with barely a thought.
I don’t want him traded.
Maybe a 6th Man role, but we’ve got to see how we do in the next few weeks to see if our current starting lineup can play well night in and night out. If Oberto shows us good stuff as a starter and there’s a question as to whether or not Jamison should be coming off the bench… Well, it’s a good problem to have.

"One-on-one? You can't." -Gilbert Arenas
JC Bandwagon all day!

by kseandoyle on Oct 29, 2009 7:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

i cant believe so many people on here are advocating for Jameson to be the 6th man! Oberto can’t start long-term as he couldn’t do it playing next to Tim Duncan!!! And don’t get me started on Blatche – IT WAS ONE GAME! – until Blatche does it for a month straight (which he couldnt even do in summer league) he’ll always be the 2nd big off the bench. … Jameson is very difficult to guard for opposing PF and that alone adds to the team.

by bigity b on Oct 30, 2009 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

When Antawn comes back

And starts at the four, Andray and Oberto are the 4 and 5 in the second unit, and JaVale is available for spot duty, we’ll wonder why the word “dilemma” was ever used. I’ll take an embarassment of riches in the front court, relatively speaking. And if Antawn (god forbid) does fall off a bit this year, it’ll be moot because nobody will trade for his contract then. Like it or not, this is our team.

I like it.

by bronco6778 on Oct 30, 2009 10:26 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

"Well, it’s a good problem to have."

Dead On kseandoyle-

Indeed- assuming we are winning and AB plays at this level (one games level BTW) this is indeed a good problem to have. And considering his leadership and character AJ will handle it like the pro he is.

With

by DCPerspective on Oct 30, 2009 10:59 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Antawn is a gamer, but I also think he wants to win and is a vet who will accept whatever role he is given when he comes back. It all comes down to matchups and if we really need power at our 4 spot. Its great though that Blatche and others are getting extended time early in the year.

by pas493 on Oct 30, 2009 12:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

i wouldnt get too excited about Blatche’s production. Didn’t he do the same thing every year in summer league – go off for 20 and 10 in the first game and then fall flat for the next several games. … Jameson isn’t your typical PF, but he offers a dimension that is very difficult to guard for the traditional PF. (and I hated him for years and cant believe i’m defending him) Besdies, he’s Abe’s new Unseld so unless Abe kicks it, AJ will be here too. …

by bigity b on Oct 30, 2009 3:16 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hmmm

He is a great leader.

Really? I believe he was at fault for the veteran-young guy division that was created on this team (which Flip has been working to fix). Great leaders don’t lump together subgroups of their followers and criticize them. That’s called creating outgroups and is disasterous to chemistry. I like Jamison the player, but I hope he stops “leading” now that we have better people for that role. He’s way too much of a finger-pointer (never genuinely at himself).

I’m actually curious about how his return might go myself. It seems like what would happen if Blatche stays strong (three games in, Blatche is averaging about 21-7 in 30 mpg with steady D), we probably “Odom” Blatche, and see how Jamison does in Flip’s defense. I like Oberto, but Jamison is the far superior talent and Oberto’s starting now, so it’s an easy switch. Oberto moves to 2nd big man off the bench.

by steadyhand on Nov 1, 2009 1:53 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

No

I believe he was at fault for the veteran-young guy division that was created on this team

No the whole division was started by Eddie Jordan, not Antawn Jamison. If Jamison did start the veteran-young guy division and was so “disasterous to chemistry” then why is he still probably the most well respected player in the Wizards locker room? Why has nobody on the team ever said anything bad about him or questioned his leadership? If his actions were “disasterous to chemistry” don’t you think that it would have been noticed by now?

People on this site sometimes unfairly critisize Jamison and take him out of context and just overlook it when he says something good about a young player. None of his critiscisms are out of the way and all of them are true most of the time. They only help if anything, not hurt the team.

by lj15 on Nov 1, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I believe AJ talks too much

and doesn’t lead by example. He puts forth pathetic EFFORT on the defensive end. Can’t really blame NY or JM or AB for not putting any defensive effort when the teams two highest paid players have proven if you can score you don’t even have to try on the defensive end.

by BayAreaBullet on Nov 11, 2009 6:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs