What do we trade the 18th pick for?

by NY1 on May 11, 2008 10:33 PM EDT Comment 31 comments

So Ernie Grunfeld has given clues that we'll be packaging away the 18th pick for a valuable player who can help this team improve. Who do you guys think, if there is a trade, we'll trade for?

There is obviousely a need for a SF backup for Caron and a big time rebounding big man. We've gone over potential free agent pickups but what players can we potentially trade for?

I expect us to make the deal with a rebuilding team seeking draft picks. Teams like the Grizzlies, Timberwolves, Sonics, Heat, and Pacers will probably jump at this offer. All these teams have studs who could become Washington Wizards.

A guy who the Wizards should take a look at is Jermaine O'Neal. A few yeras back this would sound completely ridiculous but his stock has flown down. Indiana looks like they've decided to head in another direction and build around guys like Dunleavy, Tinsley, and Granger. O'Neal is not the leader of that team anymore. I understand that it will cost alot for a guy who's injury prone but he's not going to play superstar minutes like he's used to so he should be able to stay on the court for more games.

Maybe I sound completely crazy, I think I'm onto something here. This could be the Wizards oppurtunity to grab a valuable big.

This represents the view of the user who wrote the FanPost, and not the entire Bullets Forever community. We're a place of many opinions, not just one.

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I agree with trading the pick...

Unless a decent, defensive-minded big man is available, like a Hibbert or Lopez. I just don’t know what you’re going to get for the 18th pick. It’s really hit-or-miss that late in the draft.

I would love to see the Wiz make a play for J. O’Neal—with a big caveat. That would be him agreeing to a backup role. Would he? Maybe if Ernie can convince him that it will extend his career, and maybe get him over this endless string of injuries. He can play either the 4 or 5, has a great attitude, and is as rugged as they come; when he’s not hurt, that is. But the injury issue is probably the only reason we’d even have a shot at him.

I do not want to see any more rookies on the team; Eddie doesn’t like playing them anyway, so what’s the point? The other question is whether they can turn Pech into a post player. If they feel they can, that could be a big boost.

by YellaFella on May 11, 2008 11:04 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

hmm

Looking at the contracts, Jermaine O’Neal makes 18+ million. To make the contracts match we would need to throw in Daniels, Thomas, Songaila, and three million which we can not give up. Looks like O’Neal would need to take a pay cut.

However, we have seen alot of strange loop holes to the contracts in trades over the past few years.

Backbone of the DMV

by NY1 on May 11, 2008 11:13 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

No loopholes here

That’s his salary; we have to match it.

I would never trade that much for Jermaine O’Neal. He isn’t that good anymore.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on May 12, 2008 6:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed.....

It would be tough to sacrifice our depth for such an injury risk.

by Truth About It on May 13, 2008 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Didn't know...

He was making that much. Ouch! Yeah, no way we should pick up that burden.

by YellaFella on May 12, 2008 8:33 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

He's also injury ridden -

does anyone have any confidence that our inept training staff could even keep him healthy? I definitely don’t.

by ooba on May 12, 2008 10:28 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Why trade?

We could definitely get an inexpensive contributor at that spot—about half the time in recent years, teams have snagged a starter at 18…the only players who haven’t performed at all are the foreigners (Pech, Belinelli) and the injury-prone (Borchardt).

1999 James Posey
2000 Quentin Richardson
2001 Jason Collins
2002 Curtis Borchardt
2003 David West
2004 J.R. Smith
2005 Gerald Green
2006 Pecherov
2007 Marco Belinelli

Sure, if the Grizzlies want to deal Rudy Gay, it’s a different story, but the 18th pick isn’t such a prize that we can expect a “stud” back.

(...but maybe a player like Chris Wilcox?)

by WRG on May 12, 2008 12:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Package

We wouldn’t just deal the 18th pick, it would most likely need to be a package deal. Chris Wilcox will be very hard to touch because the Sonics will probably want to keep the core of Jeff Green, Kevin Durant, and Chris Wilcox together for the future.

Backbone of the DMV

by NY1 on May 12, 2008 1:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Oh, definitely re: packaging

But, in this scenario, the pick would be the jewel of whatever trade offer the Wizards most likely made, right? Most, if not all of the regulars, aren’t going anywhere in the absence of overwhelming return value (guys like DSS, BTH, and Blatche are signed to under-market contracts); it’s hard to imagine a team like the Grizzlies or Sonics wanting to take on salary in the form of AD, Songaila, or Etan. There’s no expiring contract to deal, either.

So unless the 18th pick is packaged in a sign-and-trade with Gilbert or Antawn, it’s hard to imagine a deal where we get a “stud” back. That’s not to say Ernie can’t work his magic, but shouldn’t we ask a second question: “Who are we willing to give up?”

In terms of Wilcox, he’s hardly the frontcourt piece that the Sonics want to build around: Durant and Green are clearly the future for that team and will need his minutes. Plus, Wilcox will be a free agent after the season, the Sonics have myriad other big men under contract, and who knows what ownership will want to do if they’re forced to play in Seattle one more season—probably pare payroll yet again. It would be very unsurprising to see him dealt.

by WRG on May 12, 2008 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wilcox!

That was the first name that came to mind when I read this post. I’m not so sure that he is as entrenched in Seattle as you think. The Sonics do have a three man core and that is Durant, Green, and whoever they pick this year.

There’s always a soft spot in my heart for title-winning Terps so I am all for it. I think Seattle would consider a trade for some extra picks. We would probably need to toss in a player to make it work. Seattle will probably look for a veteran so I’d dangle Etan or Songaila with our #18. Although I like Wilcox, wouldn’t Nick Collison make a lot more sense though from that team?

Whoever gets picked at 18, I’m not expecting them to step foot in D.C. Our pick will either get traded, or Ernie will get someone who we can stash overseas for a couple of years. The best talent at 18 looks like it may be foreign anyways.

by Romans12 on May 14, 2008 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Why?

Why would the Pacers take back all that salary when O’Neal’s contract is finally expiring? I don’t see it.

by Jheiser3 on May 12, 2008 3:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

O'Neal

His contract doesn’t expire until 2010. There is still some ways to go before that contract is off the books.

We should also take a look at these guys:

Charlie Villanueva (tough rebounder, can play some center minutes and shoot the trey ball)

Craig Smith (Hustle player, does the little things. Won’t cost us much.)

Udonis Haslem (If the Heat get Beasley and keep Marion, won’t Haslem fall into a logjam? I’m sure the Heat could use that 18th pick for a PG)

Mikki Moore (They’re developing Hawes and have a lottery pick coming up. The Kings also have a crowded front court and wouldn’t they want a mentor who doesn’t demand minutes, maybe a veteran like Etan Thomas who may not be the most talented but plays hard every night.)

Drew Gooden (Obviousely we all know his game after playing him in the playoffs in ‘06 and ‘07. This guy is probably going to be moved this off-season because Chicago has Tyrus Thomas and Joakim Noah two young studs at the 4 position who will improve with more playing time. He would have to play the 5 and definitely wouldn’t be a scoring option but would be nice behind Haywood.)

Damien Wilkins (A guy who we can play behind Caron Butler for around 15-18 MPG and can rely on to give us production. This will hopefully lessen the amount of hip injuries and chipped bones with Butler giving 100% on the floor for 40+ minutes.)

Matt Barnes (Another guy who we can expect production from behind Butler.)

These are just a few potential options. Alot of these guys could really boost our roster and won’t be too costly either. In many of these situations we could potentially get rid of Etan Thomas’s contract but that’s still highly unlikely.

As for who I feel we should be willing to part with. Anybody except for the starters, Nick Young, and Andray Blatche could head out the door. Without a doubt, DeShawn Stevenson will stay a Wizard if Arenas is re-signed.

Backbone of the DMV

by NY1 on May 12, 2008 4:44 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Yes he has 2 years and 44Mil left on his deal. I don’t think he has that much left in his tank. He may not be as old as Camby or Foster but he has 795 games played in the NBA plus FIBA and Olympics games.

Once Gilbert is signed Ernie can move whoever he wants, Deshawn included.

Matt Barnes is a favorite of mine but he seems like more of the same, undersized/over-matched 3ish type playing PF that we already have too many of. Love his game just not sure its a step forward for this team. He made 3Mil last year too.

Wilcox should be available.

I consider Songalia the back-up 5 and Blatche more of a 4 functionally. So I’d love to move DS, Songalia and the pick for a Center who could make a real impact on the boards or shot blocking. Has to be a guy that can defend the post with some skill and not just hustle and grit like Darius.

by Jheiser3 on May 12, 2008 9:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Are there any bigs better than...

Hibbert? He can pass and rebound. While his game is still developing (very raw) you can’t teach size. I doubt Cle could have rebounded like that with Hibbert in. His biggest problem is getting in foul trouble which will be mitigated by coming off the bench and having six fouls. People sleep on him because he didn’t score tons of points, but his efficiency was great. Really, if we could move OPec plus the 18th to ensure Hibbert why not?

by zeke5123 on May 14, 2008 12:04 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I Agree

But others here like TruthAboutIt think he’s too much of a stiff. Still, I like the idea of having someone 7’2” 278 lbs. in the lane to help defend. I think a big reason our 3-point defense was so horrible this season was because Randy Ayers had our wingmen sag into the lane to double up on guys too big for our bigs to guard. What do you expect when you have guys like Songaila (6’8” 240lbs.) playing center? With someone like Hibbert playing D, I think Ayers can have our guards/small forwards stay home on the perimeter and protect the arc.

"It's OK for the Bullets to trade baskets, as long as they can score on their end." -- Words of wisdom from Phil Chenier

by cuppettcj on May 14, 2008 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hibbert

Eh…I think he’s gonna flop big-time. His game is so soft and watching him play makes me uncomfortable for some reason. He’s just awkward…doesn’t look like he belongs out there. Granted, his game is much improved and I like that he is local.

I agree with your assessment that we need someone in the paint who can rebound and defend. Hibbert only put up double digit rebound numbers five times this year. To me, at 7’2, thats pathetic. I would much rather have a 6’9 Joey Dorsey who grabbed double digit boards 18 times last year and is anything but soft. A ton of those came on the offensive glass. Not to mention, he’s learned to thrive on a team that loves to run and score. His points are nothing but garbage. He could have a Millsapian-type of influence for our Wizards.

Plus, watching Chris Paul and Tyson Chandler toss oop after oop against the Spurs makes me really want one big guy that can go up and get a ball three or four times a game in traffic and throw it down. I think that would be huge for us. Blatche isnt aggressive enough, Haywood simply cant catch or he’d be perfect, and I dont think Songaila can even touch the rim.

Sounds like we need to have a post analyzing our potential picks. Any big draft guys in here go check out the videos on this kid JaVale McGee and let me know what you think. If we have to pick someone at 18, here’s your perfect stash on the bench and wait guy.

by Romans12 on May 14, 2008 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

To be fair

Georgetown played at an extremely slow pace, so there aren’t too many rebounds to be had.

His rebound rate is okay, but not great. It’s certainly not awful though.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on May 14, 2008 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's only one game

but watch the final four game against Oden. He destroyed him. Ticky tack fouls are what saved Ohio St. In watching the game, to my eyes he appeared by far the best player on the court (three top five picks were playing). He has the ability to dominate, just becomes passive. I realize thats a problem but perhaps being in the NBA would improve that?

by zeke5123 on May 14, 2008 4:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

You are right on -

I was there at the final four so I saw it with my own eyes. he completely held his own against Oden. I would agree he was the best player on the court for Gtown since Jeff Green disappeared. He didn’t have the same kind of year this season however and it seemed to me that he regressed some. but I don’t know his stats so maybe not.

by ooba on May 14, 2008 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

We could do worse than Hibbert considering that he’ll get picked around the same area that Haywood was. I don’t see him as an answer here or a starting Center in the NBA either.

He’s a big kid that people convinced to play bball. You can see that he doesn’t love to play though. So what can you expect from him over an 82 game schedule? Attendance. He’ll be there, physically, every night. Everything else is a crapshoot.

by Jheiser3 on May 15, 2008 1:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

True

But he is competitive. He raised his game when it mattered. I think he likes the big moments more then basketball- Ball is simply his way of getting the big moments…

by zeke5123 on May 15, 2008 4:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Raised game?

I don’t remember him raising his game when it mattered. 0 points, 4 boards in a win over Nova. Season high 25 and 13 versus WVU in the Semis, 17 and 6 in the loss to Pitt. 13/7 in the first round and 6/1 in the game versus Davidson.

He had 5 double doubles the entire season!

by Jheiser3 on May 15, 2008 5:13 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Agreed Jheiser

At 7’2 there is no reason he should not be dominating games in college. If he can’t do it there, then what’s going to make it easier in the NBA

by AndraytheJohn on May 16, 2008 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well

For one, we wouldn’t expect him to dominate games …

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on May 16, 2008 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Slow pace + few minutes

=Few chances to amass enough time to grab so many rebounds.

I agree that he should have been better, but he’s not that bad.

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Mike Prada on May 16, 2008 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Plus if you look at the games he didn't play well in

It was due mostly to foul trouble (Nova). I cant say for sure, but in watching Hibbert he picks up alot of ticky tack fouls- stupid fouls. It’s not because he sucks at man defense.

by zeke5123 on May 18, 2008 10:16 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

could it be because he lacks lateral quickness? thats only going to be worse at the NBA level.

part of me wants to steer clear of him completely. The other sees Ilgauskas and wonders if Hibbert can’t be at least that good/valuable.

by Jheiser3 on May 20, 2008 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I dont know...

I dont think Hibbert will ever be as crafty as Ilgauskas, he may develop a better jump hook but I don’t see him ever being that crafty in terms of getting his shot off. Watching Big Z, he’s got a great feel for the game..I’m not sure if Hibbert will get to that level. We’ll see how well he develops that 3 pointer though!

I agree that lateral quickness is a major factor though, good call. He gets beat to a lot of boards because guys get off the floor and to the ball faster than he does. And yes, that is going to get much much worse in the NBA.

by Romans12 on May 20, 2008 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Given his height I see a long future in the NBA, of getting dunked on. he may wind up being decent but he is going to take some jams on his noggin too.

by Jheiser3 on May 22, 2008 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fouls...

Are alot easier to pick up in the NBA. He might not get alot of minutes on this team but even then, look at Andray Blatche earlier this season.

Backbone of the DMV

by NY1 on May 18, 2008 10:27 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

What do you expect...

Though, at #18? If he was a franchise center, he’d be going #1. He’s definitely worth a gamble at that slot, IMO. He absolutely fills a critical need (the other, as has been pointed out, being PG).

by YellaFella on May 19, 2008 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs