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Darius Songaila is Lithuanian, but he's NOT a Lithuanian gangster

Clearly, a big win tonight.  Sadly, a lot of the focus for the next few games will be over Darius Songaila's punch/slap/whatever you want to call it.  There's a few people who think he will end up getting suspended for Game 6, but before Stu Jackson puts down his ruling, hopefully he considers the following evidence...

 

First, let's take a look at the video (WARNING: Contains excessive amounts of Reggie Miller):

Now, I'll admit when I first saw it that I was pretty scared for a few reasons. among them:

  1. I'm not sure I want to live in a world where this man is a violent person.
  2. If he would've been ejected on the spot and the Wizards had gone on to lose the game, that would've been the bizarre exclamation point on a bizarre series.
  3. The last thing we need is Jay-Z trying to rhyme Songaila with something.

Thankfully, the last 2 didn't happen and I don't think #1 is true either.  Maybe it's my blue and gold colored glasses, but I don't think the "punch" was deliberately malicious, and I have evidence to back it up, in the form screencapping goodness (click on the image for the full size image).

Ds1qg1_medium

Here's where it starts to go down, LeBron is making a drive to the hoop and you can see that he and Darius' arms are starting to tangle, with LeBron's elbow under Songaila's arm.

Ds2xt0_medium

Now we've moved forward and you can see that they've managed to get themselves in a nice little tangle here.  It's nothing intentional on either side, it's just basketball.

Ds5mx9_medium

Fast forwarding a little more (in a half-a-second later kind of way) we can see them starting to untangle themselves, with the problem still being that LeBron's arm is wrapped around Darius' arm.  Even if this was square dancing, this still would be a pretty awkward arrangement, as if having two 6'9" guys crash your square dance wasn't awkward enough.

Ds3bks5_medium

Ds6ra3_medium

As you can see, we've got a little more separation but their arms are still intertwined with LeBron's arm under Songaila's.   Naturally, when you've got an arm resting on top of yours, your reaction is to lift your arm up because eventually you'll be able to get that arm off of you if you reach up high enough.  In the next cap you can see LeBron doing just that:

Ds7ue0_medium

Now you can start to see where it's all going wrong.  Because of their awkward positioning, LeBron's natural instinct to raise his hands up is sending Songaila's arm right into his face.  I think you all know what happens next.

Ds8in2_medium

Ds9qk3_medium

If you notice in the video, the only ones that really seem to get riled up about the whole thing are the players and coaches that weren't involved.  Darius is more focused on trying to explain his case to the refs and LeBron is making sure that all of his teeth are still in.  Don't you think that if Songaila had intentionally punched him that maybe they'd exchange words or dirty looks or something?

Hopefully that convinced you that the hit wasn't intentional.  If it didn't, just remember that Darius is an exceptionally generous man.

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Comcast...it's your turn to step up

As you obviously have an alternative angle on this fiasco.

by Truth About It on May 1, 2008 1:40 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Well Done

I cannot believe there are so many people that think that Darius, of all people, would throw a punch at their precious bron-bron. From my view, it was a total accident and quite an acting job on Lebron’s part to pretend that he was stunned and hurt from the slap. I was just as surprised as Buck and Phil that he got a technical for it.

"It was the best of times, it was the BLURST of times!!!?? Stupid Monkeys!" ---Montgomery Burns

by Chimp Rage on May 1, 2008 2:14 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Great screen caps

I’m watching my tape of the game right now and I was waiting for this play. It completely looks accidental to me. They are tangled up and its inadvertent that the arm comes up into the face. The league better watch this in full detail. And not just suspend Darius because of their love for Lebaby. I also taped the game on TNT – big mistake. Reggie and Marv are buffoons. I miss my Wizards biased Phil and Steve.

by ooba on May 1, 2008 5:44 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

It doesn't seem so black and white to me

I don’t think darius intentionally punched lebron. Their arms were tangled up and the far far stronger king james definitely pulled up on his arm. But darius was clearly pissed off and flailed his arms a little more than necessary to disentangle himself which resulted in the slap. I don’t think it deserves a suspension (especially not since KG walked on his blatant after the play elbow), but the T was warranted.

by five by five on May 1, 2008 6:26 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

I asked the question last night

How Wiz fans were going to justify this one. I got my answer. Thank you.

For what its worth, I think its laughable to suggest Songalia did this “on accident”. No, I don’t think Songalia is a dirty player or a violent player. But people do all kinds of things when they get caught up in the moment. If you look at your screen cap right before Songalia karate chops LeBron, it’s obvious he’s looking right at him. He knew what he was doing. I don’t think he should be suspended, but I do think he should have been ejected last night. But of course you guys are going to try to justify this…..your Wiz fans. And of course I’m going to think it was intentional….I’m a Cavs fan. That’s the nature of being a fan.

Anyway, it had little to do with the outcome of the game. The Wiz made plays in the last minute and the Cavs simply didn’t. I told you guys before that this Cavs team falls asleep when they feel comfortable, and when they went up 5 with 1:30 left, they thought it was over and they stopped playing. Before they knew what had hit them, the Wizards took the lead and LeBron couldn’t get it going again. Credit to the Wiz for making plays when they needed to and shame on the Cavs for not. We’ve got ourselves a series again.

by RockKing on May 1, 2008 9:56 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

I should've phrased that better

Accident was the wrong word to use there. Do I think LeBron unintentionally drove Darius’ arm into his face? Yes, but I’m incredibly biased. Could Darius have done more to try and keep it from happening? Probably, but I’d also argue that he could’ve done a lot more to make it more painful too. Does that make it suspension-worthy? I don’t know, but considering that Kevin Garnett got away with SHOVING A REF, I don’t think any of us can really know what the NBA is going to say about this.

Bullets Forever: Your home for blogging on the dumbest team in the history of civilization.

by JakeTheSnake on May 1, 2008 10:52 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Exactly

Looks like we see what we want to see. I still think its funny to claim Songalia was innocent in all this. But whatever. Sometimes it seems I need to emphasize certain points around here, so I’ll say it again. I do NOT think Songalia should be suspended for it. Because yes, Songalia absolutely could have made it a lot worse.

by RockKing on May 1, 2008 11:11 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Just a clarification (because I'm an idiot)

I meant to say “Does that make it ejection-worthy?”

Bullets Forever: Your home for blogging on the dumbest team in the history of civilization.

by JakeTheSnake on May 1, 2008 11:30 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Gotcha

Well, I think Songalia did it on purpose, so I do think it was ejection worthy. If it wasn’t on purpose, then its probably not ejection worthy.

by RockKing on May 1, 2008 12:51 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Another follow up....

The “he’s looking right at him” defense doesn’t really work.

Yea, he’s obviously looking at him…..”GEV MIE MY ARRM BOCK U AMERRICON TERR-OR-EIST!!”

by Truth About It on May 1, 2008 12:43 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

you are one dumb mofo if you think that wasn’t an accident.

by Cleveland Traveliers on May 2, 2008 5:01 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Wow

Classy comeback. Quality addition to this discussion buddy.

by RockKing on May 2, 2008 7:10 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Not sure who you're responding to....

But my comment was more intended to be a joke….sorry if that makes me a dumb “mofo”

I think we can continue to go back and forth on this subject…..and as I’ve said, if the TNT angle was the only clip that I saw, then I might be inclined to think otherwise, even with Jake’s great breakdown.

Perhaps the fact that their arms go tangled up was no “accident”—it was a foul on Songaila…and maybe he meant to foul LeBron.

And perhaps it was no “accident” that Songaila desired to pull his arm away from being locked up with LeBron and that the force of said motion, combined with the motion of LeBron’s, led to contact.

I think it’s conclusive (especially, like we’ve said, if you see the baseline angle we saw on Comcast) that what happened was not intentional….and I think it’s rather absurd for anyone to think otherwise.

(and here I am…I thought I’d told myself that I would argue about this no more)

by Truth About It on May 2, 2008 11:18 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Sorry, truth

I was replying to Cleveland Traveliers (clever name, btw). Just didn’t see how calling anyone a “dumb mofo” for having a differing viewpoint was adding anything to this discussion.

I think I know where you stand on this, and you probably know where I stand. We can at least agree to disagree in a civil manner and with discussion, not by name calling as CT tried to do. Sorry for the misunderstanding on who I was talking to. I’m not used to this layout yet.

by RockKing on May 2, 2008 1:17 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I figured it wasn't you......

As you replied to his comment.

In any case…Darius Songaila suspended…how about that?

Let the David Stern conspiracy floodgates open! (just kidding)....or am I?

Suspend him, that’s fine. We’ll deal with that as I’m sure there will be a ton of further discussion.

I just wonder how you let KG get away with pushing a ref and Jason Kidd get away with wrapping his hand around Pargo’s neck.

I’m at a loss.

by Truth About It on May 2, 2008 1:33 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I agree

My ONLY explanation that I can come up with is that they’re trying to make up for Songalia not being ejected in Game 5. I know, I know, you guys think it was LeBron’s fault and that Songalia was completely innocent…..but most Cavs fans don’t see it that way at all, and my guess is that the league obviously doesn’t either. But still, I don’t like it at all. I stand what I’ve been saying all along. I hate suspensions in the playoffs (especially for something as tame as this…..it certainly could have been a lot worse), and I do NOT think Songalia should have been suspended for this.

by RockKing on May 2, 2008 1:40 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I just wish

That we could talk about the actual game for a change….especially with the Wizards (DeShawn, Gilbert, and Brendan) shutting their trap…..now this will dominate our discussions.

Oh well.

by Truth About It on May 2, 2008 2:54 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Rock King- Deep Breaths

I understand you being pissed, watching that angle and listening to Albert/Miller huff and puff. The local DC sports TV had a much better shot from behind the basket and you call tell that Lebron’s arm was hooked inside Darius’s arm. When Lebron tried to yank it out, then Darius’ arm flung towards him.

It was completely accidental and there was no real intentional punch. I hope you get a chance to see this camera angle.

And, yes, series is back on!

What? They don't have TV in the D-League? Don't watch me, watch TV.

by Mac G on May 1, 2008 10:36 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Why do you guys always assume I'm pissed?

I always get accused of mocking or being pissed around here. Why? Because I’m presenting an alternate point of view? I’m perfectly calm about this. I’m not that upset about it. I think he should have been ejected from the game for it, but as I said, it had no bearing on the outcome of the game.

by RockKing on May 1, 2008 11:14 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Because your hand is on fire!

You ever seen a guy with a hand on fire act calm?

No seriously, I think it’s just stuff that gets lost in translation. If these conversations were happening face to face I’m positive that everyone would see that you’re taking a calm. respectful approach to this. It’s just when conversations like this are stripped down to just words (especially in the middle of an intense playoff series), sometimes what we say comes off differently than we intend it to.

I’m not sure if that made any sense, but I guess what I’m trying to say is that I personally don’t think you’re pissed. It’s just one of those weird quirks about the internet.

Bullets Forever: Your home for blogging on the dumbest team in the history of civilization.

by JakeTheSnake on May 1, 2008 11:57 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I think what Jake is saying....

is that you need to use more emoticons and words like “toodles” and then you would totally be calm, cool and collective.

by Truth About It on May 1, 2008 12:39 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Probably

People assume that just because I’m on here discussing this, that I must be trying to flame this site. I assure y’all that’s not what I’m doing. I just enjoy discussing things with people who have opposing points of view.

by RockKing on May 1, 2008 12:53 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I know....

You’ve been very civil and I hope that you feel that you’ve been treated to same way.

Discussion is a good thing.

by Truth About It on May 1, 2008 1:48 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

What he said.

Bullets Forever: Your home for blogging on the dumbest team in the history of civilization.

by JakeTheSnake on May 1, 2008 1:51 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I think it just took people a while

to warm up to my style and understand that I’m here for discussion and not childish flaming. Other than a post here and there, I have no problems with the way I have been treated here and I have been enjoying it thoroughly. And I look forward to discussing both teams’ approaches to Game 6.

by RockKing on May 1, 2008 2:02 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

my two cents

“I asked the question last night how Wiz fans were going to justify this one. I got my answer. Thank you.”

you don’t think that comes off as disparaging to wiz fans? or at the very least condescending? of course you’re putting people on the defensive. things definitely get lost in translation on internet posts, but you’re not helping yourself out with your wording in several of your posts. so, before you start blaming us for the misinterpretation, take a minute and think on how you could word things to try to avoid that in the future.

that being said, (speaking for myself) it is good to have someone with a cavs perspective on this site, who, once you get through the misunderstanding, obviously isn’t trying to flame this site.

by DarrellWalkerFan on May 1, 2008 1:06 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I guess

If you don’t know me (which none of you do), then I guess I can see how you could interpret it that way. I don’t know what to tell you, though. My tone would be drastically different here if I was trying to be disparaging. But as a fan, I knew that opposing fans would be defending Songalia on this one, and I was seriously curious how this defense would be approached. And I got my answer, which is all I was trying to relay.

by RockKing on May 1, 2008 1:32 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I can't watch the video

...because I can’t stand the inane and ridiculous play calling of Reggie Miller and Marv Albert. What a horrible tandem.

"My only regret is that I have boneitis." - That Guy on Futurama

by Wizards on May 1, 2008 10:43 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

To follow up.....

No one is saying that Darius Songaila wasn’t trying to get his arm unlocked…..I’m sure that movement on his part contributed to the violent appearance of the act.

Everyone at ESPN and various media outlets seem to only be privy to that one angle from TNT…..and if that’s the only angle that I saw, then I might falsely conclude maliciousness on the part of Songaila as well.

But trust us here….Comcast in DC showed multiple angles from the baseline and it was clear that this was nothing but an unfortunate accident.

Thankfully, that unjust technical did not have an effect on the outcome of the game.

by Truth About It on May 1, 2008 10:46 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

For what it's worth, Tim Legler's on Darius' side

Sure, his only claim to fame is winning the 3-point competition as a member of the Wiz back in the 90s, but Legler is now an “unbiased” ESPN announcer (note the sarcasm). He said people made a bigger deal out of this than needed. All the other yokels – Barkley, Kenny, Marv, and Reg – wore Lebron underoos during their analysis.

Throwing in my 2 cents, I think the refs got it 100% correct. It deserved a technical, not an ejection and certainly not a suspension. If they suspend Songaila for Game 6, we’ll be forced to unleash Dominic Mcguire, and then maybe James will really get hurt.

by jvflail on May 1, 2008 1:28 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

This is like the Zapruder Film

Great work here. Lebron is a tricky guy.

by Gils_Keloids on May 1, 2008 12:15 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

back...and to the left.

sorry; couldn’t resist…

by Pryme on May 1, 2008 3:58 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Since it still doesnt seem clear for some people...

You have to see the comcast angle to actually understand how it happened. First of all, Darius did foul LeBron on the way to the hoop. As James comes down he runs into Darius and somehow their arms become entangled as Darius then seems to let his arm go limp (it looks as if he was just trying to be as passive as possible after the contact and avoid any crazy stuff). James reacts to the entanglement by quickly jerking his arm upward to clear himself from Darius – the only problem is that Darius’ limp arm is sitting on top of LeBron’s arm, and gets propelled upwards by James’ quick motion. You know the rest.

Am I biased? Sure. But I can’t make this stuff up. The Comcast replay clearly shows that all the force from the blow was generated by James’ arm movement. Now, is Darius crafty enough to let his arm go limp knowing when James’ jerks away it will cause a little love tap to the jaw? Maybe, maybe not. Still not suspension worthy. As Jake wisely points out, players who just were involved in an intentional punch/blow/slap do not calmly walk away from each other and try to explain things. That’s just common sense.

I don’t really blame the refs – they are on edge (just from the previous games and all the talk) and they had a terrible angle too. At least they realized that the whole play was generated by the entanglement and so when they saw Darius’ arm fly up they thought he was reacting badly but they also realized it wasn’t really a punch (or he would have been tossed in a heartbeat!).

Getting buckets since 2003.

by Icantfeelmyface on May 1, 2008 12:17 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

To make this even more clear:

Imagine a limp arm resting in the crook of your right elbow with the other person’s hand close to your chest. Then imagine where his hand would go if you quickly jerked your arm upwards and out as he kept his arm limp.

Getting buckets since 2003.

by Icantfeelmyface on May 1, 2008 12:20 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Just another LeBron flop job

Grabs Songaila’s arm, punches himself in the face with it, then looks like mean ol’ Darius just stole his lunch money. Is he taking flopping lessons from Varejao?

"Now, obviously individual production does not unilaterally equal better team production, but there's a high level of causation."

by Vanilla Gorilla on May 1, 2008 1:17 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

it's funny

how subject to interpretation this is. when i was watching the game last night on comcast, it did look like lebron caused the contact. but when i watch the clip from tnt, it clearly looks like songaila hit him.

either way, if it was intentional, i don’t think it was especially malicious, and i do think lebron played a big part in it getting to that point with the extracurriculars during the arm tangling, so i think a technical on songaila was fair. i do not think a suspension is justified.

barkley and smith both seemed to think the same way at halftime: they thought darius gave lebron a little “chicken wing” but neither of them thought it was a big deal.

if people are talking suspension for this, they should first take a look at the elbow Z hit songaila with in the second half on one of lebron’s drives and dunks. that looked a lot more rugged and was definitely intentional.

by DarrellWalkerFan on May 1, 2008 1:33 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

In my opinion

people need to stop crying for suspensions, period. I hate suspensions in the NBA Playoffs. Teams should want to try to beat their opponents at full strength. It seems like every time there’s any kind of contact, everyone starts throwing around the “S” word. Songalia should not be suspended, and neither should Z. I have no problems with ejections, but to be suspended, I think the player should have to do something awfully malicious.

by RockKing on May 1, 2008 1:37 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Amen!

Bullets Forever: Your home for blogging on the dumbest team in the history of civilization.

by JakeTheSnake on May 1, 2008 1:43 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I agree

I hate the flagrant foul calls too.

When a 7 footer and 6’8 260 man, collide full speed, what does the NBA expect is going to happen?

If it is the type of dirty foul that would start a fight on the playground, then it needs to be called a flagrant but most of them are just hard, physical plays. It is basketball.

What? They don't have TV in the D-League? Don't watch me, watch TV.

by Mac G on May 1, 2008 1:46 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

I think we can all agree

at least some of the “overreacting” from referrees is partially our own fault. When you know you’re gonna foul hard to prevent easy baskets, KEEP IT TO YOURSELF. Don’t talk to everyone about it, don’t spend all day talking trash…the refs are only human and they hear what goes on also.
Of course we are gonna be watched more than the Cavs. Not saying its fair, that’s just the way it is.
And for the record, I completely think Songalia’s “punch” was unintentional. But I also don’t think he acted like an innocent person. He looked ready to fight if that was needed, which isn’t a bad thing.

by DynaMix on May 1, 2008 3:21 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

I don't think Songaila was ready to fight....

It was more along the lines of Crocodile Dundee’s….”That’s not a knife, THIS is a knife.” line.

D-Song was simply ready to show LeBron what a real, intentional punch-slap-chop felt like.

by Truth About It on May 1, 2008 4:28 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I would like Darius so much more

if he adopted a faux Australian accent

by Aldo on May 1, 2008 4:35 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I'd still rather see him pick up the Borat impression full time

Together with Pecherov, they’d make for craziest European pairing ever.

Bullets Forever: Your home for blogging on the dumbest team in the history of civilization.

by JakeTheSnake on May 1, 2008 4:51 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Ha.

I know winning is what we’re trying to get to, but by far, this is the weirdest, most funny team out there. I hope nothing happens to it (I know this probably won’t ever happen).

"My only regret is that I have boneitis." - That Guy on Futurama

by Wizards on May 1, 2008 4:55 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I'd like him more if....

He wore some type of utility belt when he wasn’t on the court. It’d contain things like:

A fake mustache
A Lithuanian Flag that could serve as an impromptu poncho
Loads of Bubble Tape and Big League Chew
A Doo-Rag and/or headband
Brass knuckles
A cache of random fireworks
A Black & Mild
Soap
A poster of G.L.O.W. – the Glorious Ladies of Wrestling
Something with animal prints
A Lupe Fiasco CD

And many, many more…

by Truth About It on May 1, 2008 5:43 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

A Slap In The Face

Lebron James should have charged with a FOUL he had Songalia’s arm wraped around his if you look at the tap good as Songalia try to get away James hooked it to him himself to cause a FOUL on Songalia’s arm. King James? Is a baby.

by dicjames on May 1, 2008 5:05 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Songalia

It was a good foul by Songalia. Lebron drove. Rather than give up the easy lay up or dunk, Songalia went for the ball and arms hard enough to prevent a potential “and one”. The two players got their arms tangled. Lebron tried to get away which I believe caused most of the force of the back handed slap to the chin. No Tech should have been called, but I think the officials were trying to make sure this game did not get out of hand given some the bad blood. I think they must have reviewed the tape and realized that no punch was thrown or Songalia would have been ejected. Obviously the officials are smarter than Reggie Miller who stated that Songalia punched Lebron. What an idiot.

by cavsfan on May 2, 2008 12:29 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

BS

I cannot believe Songalia was supsended…Stern is a joke…

by DynaMix on May 2, 2008 1:54 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Furious...

I am so furious right now I can hardly speak. The Wizards (as an organization) need to seriously protest in some manner that will get Stern and Jackson’s attention. Ridiculous.

As for motivational fire for the Wizards, it can’t get handed to you any easier.

"My only regret is that I have boneitis." - That Guy on Futurama

by Wizards on May 2, 2008 1:59 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I am a CAVS fan and I am furious. I am not sure how anyone can watch that play and come away with any conclusion other than accidental contact. Haywood does not draw a suspension for a dangerous play, Stevenson does not draw a suspension for a questionable play, kid does not draw a suspension for an extremely dangerous play, kg draws does not draw a suspension for pushing an official. David Stern is the Devil.

by cavsfan on May 2, 2008 2:32 PM EDT reply reply   1 recs

Agreed

I can’t believe Kidd wasn’t suspended, in particular. He threw someone down by the neck, and yet, he keeps playing. Huh?

You know you'll get devoured by Cheaney, Wallace, and Juwan Howard.

by Pradamaster on May 2, 2008 2:41 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Was there some angle on this play that was not shown on television? Every replay I saw clearly shows a good clean foul intended to prevent an easy layup or dunk. Two guys got tangled up and one got slapped in the face while trying to separate. This shows what is wrong with NBA officiating. Very inconsistant. BS.

by cavsfan on May 2, 2008 2:43 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs

I think Stern did this to add fuel to the fire. Must be good for ratings. NBA is turning into WWF.

by cavsfan on May 2, 2008 3:27 PM EDT reply reply   0 recs


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